Interesting Tidbit on Arwen.....(actually really interesting)

[downflow311]

go this page and read the article about ROTK.
http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/view/7317/7317.jpg

here is the link: http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/view/7317

in the middle column it says:

"Viggo Mortensen as Aragorn (above left) dominates the last part of the trilogy, but we will see most of the 'gang' who, one way or another, are still here - even if a bit of cinematic license has been used to keep Liv Tyler, above right, around as Arwen."

Did Liv Tyler not show up for reshoots or something? anyone know anything about this????

[downflow311]

if someone knows how to link to the pic, please do so so we can have it posted in the thread, i dont know how to do it, i give up. i finally find something of real interest to post in this forum and i cant figure out how to post the damn scan, $hit...

[freakyplatypus]

Arwen seems to have a bigger part in the movies than in the books

[downflow311]

did you read the article? what does it mean when it says "to keep liv tyler around as arwen?" did she ditch out on PJ or something?

[NotNormal]

She had only a small part to play in the last book

So I guesse they meant they have found a way to expand her part in the movie.

[downflow311]

but it says a bit of "cinematic license has been used to keep liv tyler around as arwen." maybe the tolkein family didnt want arwen around in ROTK and new line used the cinematic license to keep her around, or maybe liv tyler pulled out and they used the cinematic license to keep her in it, thats the way im reading it.

[evenstar]

I think by cinematic license they mean that they've just messed around with the basic plot (ie the book) to increase Arwens involvement, an example being the idea that in TTT Arwen was going to appear at Helms Deep.

[freakyplatypus]

which I think is F**ked UP

[evenstar]

I would have like more Faramir and Eowyn than extra Arwen

[ILOVEKATIE]

I like Arwen, thats all I have to say.

[evenstar]

yeah I love her too (see my name) but just hoping no silly changes in plot

[ILOVEKATIE]

I agree

[downflow311]

I wonder what they are going to do with her character. i think it would really add some drama and emotional effect if they killed off arwen, it would make the movie that much more powerful IMO, and it wouldnt upset the tolkein purists out there too much, considering she isnt hardly even in the books

[DangerMouse]

You have to remember that Arwen and Aragorn get married after the ring is destroyed and Mordor is defeated. Its a pretty important plot point.

[freakyplatypus]

killing her would be extremely unfaithful to tolkein and pretty stupid also.

[downflow311]

i would love it. i dont think stupid would be the right word, i think unfaithful to the story would be the correct phrase. but PJ has made changes so far, Elves at Helms Deep for example, was a pretty good idea and killing off Haldir made the battle a bit more emotional. Pellenor is going to make HD look like a neighborhood argument, and as a result HD wont be very significant to the story as a whole. they should have killed arwen at HD, she was originally going to be at HD but then they took her out. that would have made HD more memorable. after ROTK comes out, people will forget about HD, ROTK's scope is 10 times as big as TTT.

[Spy-Of-Saruman]

Some people just like bad stuff to happen dont they...

Arwen at Helms Deep

Arwen Dying

Treebeard in the battle of the Pelennor Fields

Killing Faramir and Eowyn

I mean, what the hell?

[Macbane]

Originally posted by downflow311
i would love it. i dont think stupid would be the right word, i think unfaithful to the story would be the correct phrase. but PJ has made changes so far, Elves at Helms Deep for example, was a pretty good idea and killing off Haldir made the battle a bit more emotional. Pellenor is going to make HD look like a neighborhood argument, and as a result HD wont be very significant to the story as a whole. they should have killed arwen at HD, she was originally going to be at HD but then they took her out. that would have made HD more memorable. after ROTK comes out, people will forget about HD, ROTK's scope is 10 times as big as TTT.

I think "stupid" would be the perfect word to describe killing off Arwen in the movies. As insignificant as she may have seemd in the books, she still played a big part in Aragorn's story, and PJ & Co. deciding to kill her off would be dumb. Not that they're gonna do it, but it would still be a terrible idea to alter the story in such a way.

[downflow311]

how would it be stupid? like its not as intelligent as her fate in the books? stupid is not the right word. it takes the same intelligence to keep her as it does to kill her. i think inappropriate is a better word, you guys must like really like bashing people's opinons; geeks.

[freakyplatypus]

I do like bashing peoples opinions!

[downflow311]

then you need to buy a dictionary.

[freakyplatypus]

Wy doo u sei thadt?

No seriously what did I spell wrong?

[downflow311]

read the whole thread, then youll understand. it has nothing to do with spelling; actually you need a thesaurus my bad.

[freakyplatypus]

Why do I need a thesaurus?
I said all that I wanted to say.
I didn't need to jazz it up at all.
Why use larger, more complex words if you don't need them at all??

[downflow311]

Originally posted by freakyplatypus
killing her would be extremely unfaithful to tolkein and pretty stupid also.

read every post after this^ one. im just being a d!ck because i am offended that you called my opinion stupid.......
stupid is used incorrectly. read the argument i had with that other guy.

[freakyplatypus]

Oh and this is from Dictionary.com:
Stupid - Marked by a lack of intelligence or care; foolish or careless: a stupid mistake.

Killing her off would be foolish and careless - therefore being stupid.

You were right about one thing: you were being a dick.

[LOTRfan]

now now simmer down children. "There's no need to get angry" (corny i know)
And hey they didn't censor that d word out! So downflow didn't need to use the explanation point instead. Sorry...just thought I'd share that.
Here's my professsional opinion : There is a total lack of communication going on here. Downflow felt insulted when you used the word "stupid." So he was searching for a new word to "better" describe it and thus suggested a dictionary, then a thesaurus (actually i think downflow was right the first time-a dictionary would be more helpful as a thesaurus would give you words that also mean stupid like brainless, dim-witted, unintelligent. That would achieve the opposite effect you wanted downflow. It would just give everyone more inappropriate words to use.) So anyway, freaky platypus then got all confused and felt the need to be mean. But I think downflow was looking at the word stupid in a different light as platypus' definition. He took it to mean that the people who consider that ending are lacking in intelligence. I agree that it may be more their judgement or their perceptions, not that they are dumb. So let's all try to be more careful of people's feelings in the future and to stop getting all technical and looking for criticisms.

[freakyplatypus]

Thank you Mr. Mackey. :D
Your guidance is appreciated.

But downflow - Please stop being so arrogant sounding!

Or maybe that's just the way I percieve it

[Macbane]

I don't think anyone was calling anyone stupid, it's just the idea of what he was implying that was stupid.

[freakyplatypus]

I simply said that killing off Arwen would be stupid.
That's all.
End of Story.
End of Thread.
Good Bye.
:D

[BRussell]

Thread of the week!

[The Moose]

killing arwen would not be a good move. she didn't need to feature in TTT really, and cutting her out of helm's deep was a good idea, but ya can't cut her out of ROTK, due to what happens in the book, which is a really important event.

with this posting, this is not the end of the thread

[PsYkOoOoO]

arwen?die?hope not...

[The Moose]

so do i

[ILOVEKATIE]

i hope they show in ROTK that shot of her laying on a bed, theres just something about that shot, she looks so pale, but the whole thing its beautiful, I hope she ain't dead though.

[PsYkOoOoO]

i dont think so....i dont think PJ's that stupid

[Wyn]

Interesting article, I personally think it means that as Arwen isnt in ROTK untill the end by adding her in nearer the beginning (even perhaps in the opening scene) its cinematic license to change that.
Oh and Downflow you keep wanting to kill off my favourite characters!! First it was Faramir and Eowyn and now Arwen next it will be Aragorn if you had your way i`d be an emotional wreck when I came out of the cinema!! lol
I dont mind them adding in Arwen more (as long as it isnt silly like someone said earlier in this thread) I would like to see more of Faramir and Eowyn than it sounds like we are going to get though.
The wellington premier sounds amazing from that article wish i could go!!

[Wyn]

I`ve just found an article on TORN which has photos of Viggo and Liv in Wellington doing reshoots so it cant be that Liv didnt go back. The article says that she had just finished her reshoots.
Heres the link:
http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/movies/rotk/view/6858

[Brock Landers]

Thanks for the article Wyn.

I'm guessing that Eowyn/Faramir love story will be played more in the EE of ROTK. That's why those extended editions are so great, the fans of the book really have the last laugh.....;)

[PsYkOoOoO]

agreed brock~

[freakyplatypus]

hmmmm.....

Brock Landers! Change your handle! It confuses me so much! I think everyones talking to me!

[downflow311]

Originally posted by Wyn
Interesting article, I personally think it means that as Arwen isnt in ROTK untill the end by adding her in nearer the beginning (even perhaps in the opening scene) its cinematic license to change that.
Oh and Downflow you keep wanting to kill off my favourite characters!! First it was Faramir and Eowyn and now Arwen next it will be Aragorn if you had your way i`d be an emotional wreck when I came out of the cinema!! lol
I dont mind them adding in Arwen more (as long as it isnt silly like someone said earlier in this thread) I would like to see more of Faramir and Eowyn than it sounds like we are going to get though.
The wellington premier sounds amazing from that article wish i could go!!

LOL LOL im just throwing ideas around. i think me and spy-of-saruman are on to some kind of arwen LOTR conspiracy theory. i think we may have some evidence that she does die in ROTK, which i think would add TONS of emotion to the story. IMO IMO

[The Moose]

i don't think that he will kill arwen, and i have faith in him. he has delivered 2 great films so far. what is the chance that ROTK will be a huge flop? even if it is, it will still have the same flavour of PJ and all the other people involved in it

[Spy-Of-Saruman]

Hmmmmmm

[evenstar]

you do alot of that

[The Moose]

i agree with you evenstar.

that is a cool name, not only for you, but also for Arwen

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by freakyplatypus
Brock Landers! Change your handle! It confuses me so much! I think everyones talking to me!

What in the hell are you talking about?

[The Moose]

don't ask me

[Brock Landers]

I wasn't planning on asking you.....:P

[Wyn]

Ok spoiler alert (nothing new and exciting lol). Just dont want anybody reading something they dont want to.
.
.
.
The photo of Arwen "dieing" I believe will either be from a scene in the epilogue *shudders* I so dont want them to have Aragorn and Arwen dieing in the film was hard enough reading the appendix. Which is probably the case whenever I think about this i always remember reading about that line that Liv said on that talk show from the appendix when they asked her to say something in elvish. Which makes me think that they could have filmed it.
Or somebody once suggested that it was Arwen becoming a mortal as in one of photos you can see someone holding her hand because she is on her own when she dies in the appendix.

I hope they do expand on the E&F storyline in the extended edition Brock I wouldnt mind then if they dont go so much into it in the theatrical version.

[downflow311]

as long as the ending has some emotion. i hope they do put arwen dying in the epilogue of the movie. just the fellowship members leaving from they grey havens wont be enough to make me sobby.

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by Wyn
I hope they do expand on the E&F storyline in the extended edition Brock I wouldnt mind then if they dont go so much into it in the theatrical version.

And thus the beauty of the extended editions

;)

[Omega Supreme]

Originally posted by downflow311
as long as the ending has some emotion. i hope they do put arwen dying in the epilogue of the movie. just the fellowship members leaving from they grey havens wont be enough to make me sobby.

For one thing, it isn't 'the fellowship members' that go to the Grey Havens. It's only Frodo and Gandalf (the only people from the actual Fellowship that go)

Secondly, quit with the whole Arwen dying thing!! The only reason it would add any weight to the film is because her role has been expanded beyond what it was in the book. I think PJ really screwed up on that point. I don't think Aragorn's motivation for fighting this war is his love for Arwen. That's some cheesy Hollywood bollocks that everyone can understand. Everyone's reason for fighting is basic survival. If they lose everything is lost. That's the point of the story. That's why the Fellowship is made up of the major races on Middle-earth, because everything is at stake.

[Thorongil]

Originally posted by Omega Supreme
For one thing, it isn't 'the fellowship members' that go to the Grey Havens. It's only Frodo and Gandalf (the only people from the actual Fellowship that go)



Sam goes eventually, although doubt that will make the movie

[The Moose]

yeha. *really cheesy superman like tone* jedi will know. ask him!

[freakyplatypus]

Originally posted by Brock Landers
What in the hell are you talking about?
The fact that my real name is the same as your user name...
I thought I told you before?? Might not have.

[The Moose]

righteho, i won't involve myself in this little conversation

[freakyplatypus]

Allrighty

[downflow311]

Originally posted by Omega Supreme
For one thing, it isn't 'the fellowship members' that go to the Grey Havens. It's only Frodo and Gandalf (the only people from the actual Fellowship that go)

Secondly, quit with the whole Arwen dying thing!! The only reason it would add any weight to the film is because her role has been expanded beyond what it was in the book. I think PJ really screwed up on that point. I don't think Aragorn's motivation for fighting this war is his love for Arwen. That's some cheesy Hollywood bollocks that everyone can understand. Everyone's reason for fighting is basic survival. If they lose everything is lost. That's the point of the story. That's why the Fellowship is made up of the major races on Middle-earth, because everything is at stake.

i didnt mean the ACTUAL whole fellowship, i thought you could figure out what i meant by that but i was wrong.

[freakyplatypus]

Maybe Liv Tyler is having sex with Peter Jackson and that's why her part is so much bigger.

[Spy-Of-Saruman]

Ewwwwwww

[The Moose]

interesting theory platypus

[freakyplatypus]

I know... very complicated one though. You have to major in quantum physics to understand it.

[Omega Supreme]

Originally posted by downflow311
i didnt mean the ACTUAL whole fellowship, i thought you could figure out what i meant by that but i was wrong.

Of course, you did make it so obvious, didn't you :rolleyes:

[Laterose]

if Arwen dies, good. It frees up Aragorn and he can marry Ewoyn.

Seriously, Arwen is in these films WAY too much

[The Moose]

the role orf arwen in FOTR was expanded, but sorta necessary to explain to the non book readers who she was and all. i think that TTT would have been fine if she hadn't apeared. but she has to have a decent part in ROTK, at least and not much more that what she is in the books

[flunky]

Arwen has been in the stroyline for the first two movies- why leave her out now?

[jediknight]

My theory has been since the first movie that since Isildor's (sp) sword was never reforged [in the movie] that Arwen is going to bring it to him in ROTK.

[Samwise Gamwich]

Originally posted by Laterose
if Arwen dies, good. It frees up Aragorn and he can marry Ewoyn.

Seriously, Arwen is in these films WAY too much

You haven't read the books have you?

Faramir marries Eowyn...

Aragorn marries Arwen...

Most of the Arwen story is taken from the appendices in ROTK.... And it adds a badly needed romantic touch to the story...

PJ is a Master Storyteller just like Disney and Lucas....
Adding this romance really enhances the story IMHO...

[freakyplatypus]

Aragorn marrying Eowyn, Laterose? WTF??

[LOTRfan]

I think she was kidding...it was more like her wishful thinking. Like Aragorn and Eowyn would be a good couple. (Correct me if I'm wrong laterose)

[Omega Supreme]

I wouldn't mind the Arwen stuff so much if they'd gotten a better actress than Liv Tyler. Sure, she looks all right (in a weird sort of way) but as soon as she opens her mouth and says her lines, it's all over.

[The Moose]

i have no problem with the arwen part, and the way that it is played

[flunky]

Liv Tyler is ok... I guess

[The Elf King]

Liv Tyler is ok, she also makes a very good elf :D
The best bit with her has got to be when she is taking frodo through the fords to rivendal at the river, she does a nice scene when frodo looks to be passing through to the shadows.

[The Moose]

that scene is cool. i want to go there. i was in that region 4 weeks ago. should have gone there. but i thought that the drive down Skipers riad was a bit windy

[The Moose]

that scene is cool. i want to go there. i was in that region 4 weeks ago. should have gone there. but i thought that the drive down Skippers road was a bit windy

[ILOVEKATIE]

I think Liv Tyler is great as Arwen, but thats just me.

[The Moose]

i think that she plays the part well, and most of the criticism of he part is due to the way that she has been written into the movies, which is not an area that Liv took part in. i also think that she is pretty hot, but that's probably me

[The Elf King]

Originally posted by The Moose
that scene is cool. i want to go there. i was in that region 4 weeks ago. should have gone there. but i thought that the drive down Skippers road was a bit windy


Ahh man your a lucky bast! hehe wish I was there :D

[PsYkOoOoO]

Originally posted by The Moose
i think that she plays the part well, and most of the criticism of he part is due to the way that she has been written into the movies, which is not an area that Liv took part in. i also think that she is pretty hot, but that's probably me

i think she was perfect for the role as well

[Brock Landers]

Live Tyler is perfect for the role. She definetely looks Elvish, she even does kind of look like the daughter of Hugo Weaving(if he had one)

[PsYkOoOoO]

yeah yeah yeah~!she looks elvish indeed~!

[Wyn]

I think Liv Tyler is perfect as Arwen and I couldnt imagine her being played by anyone else now. I really dont see why people dont like her. I think shes great.
Then again I feel the same with all the actors in LOTR.

[The Moose]

yeah. it would be really bad if someone tried to do it again in about 10 yeats, with all these strange new actors. that's the sad thing about the trilogy. sometime in the future, someone will want to make it again, and it wmay pass the technical feats of FOTR, TTT and ROTK which we are about to see, but these actors and other people will always for me, remain the only people to do it justice, and the best people for it

[sphericthor]

i hate elves, they are constantly undermining the role of men and how the are constantly fighting usless wars and crap, but if the truth be told the firt 2 wars in middle earth, or arda were in aid of the elves and the 3rd war was fought by them, so i would just like to point that out, k

[evenstar]

What about the men of Numenor who made war on the Valar and worshipped Sauron, that wasnt the nicest thing.

Liv Tyler is perfect for the role of an elf, just as Cate Blanchet is. Its the way that there both such gracious actresses.

[Omega Supreme]

Liv Tyler is a sap. I haven't liked her in anything she's done. I will say the LotR is the best work she's done though.

[The Moose]

well, this trilogy will always be seen as the first entire real life trilogy

[sphericthor]

Originally posted by sphericthor
i hate elves, they are constantly undermining the role of men and how the are constantly fighting usless wars and crap, but if the truth be told the firt 2 wars in middle earth, or arda were in aid of the elves and the 3rd war was fought by them, so i would just like to point that out, k

This comment was NOT made by me but by a friend

[evenstar]

Got the most beautiful present today, Fotr Arwen Doll, her face looks weird (nothing like Liv) but the costume accuracy is good.

[The Moose]

that is pretty much the entire reason that i don't pay much attention to those toy things, or whatever they are called

[evenstar]

I would have never have brought it myself but the fact that some one saw it and thought of me makes it different

[The Moose]

yes, that is very nice