Official MMA Thread

[onelegasy]

Some info on Tito Ortiz

As previously reported by MMAWeekly, Tito Ortiz' contract demands are for him to be paid $350,000 in guaranteed money per fight. That is a ridiculous demand that the Ortiz camp knows is ridiculous. That's not a demand that you make if you're really interested in fighting at the present time. You know, kind of like when the Ortiz camp demanded a multi-fight deal valued at more than one million dollars, only to drastically come down in price as soon as Randy Couture beat Chuck Liddell in June 2003.

Ultimately, Tito Ortiz got a significant raise after sitting out much of 2003, refusing to fight Chuck Liddell. Two fights into a six-fight contract, Ortiz demanded a raise from his contractually agreed-upon salary of $80,000 to fight and $80,000 more to win. When everyone and their dog thought that Chuck Liddell was going to beat Randy Couture at UFC 43 and there would be no other UFC fight for Ortiz other than to fight Chuck Liddell, the Ortiz camp came up with a ridiculous offer sheet valued at more than one million dollars that they knew full well would never possibly be accepted by the UFC.

As soon as Couture beat Liddell, and Ortiz felt much more confident about his chances against Couture than against Liddell, the demands came back down to earth. Tito's new contract called for him to make $125,000 for every fight and an additional $50,000 for every win. Despite publicly denying that he even got a raise (responding to a question about money at the UFC 44 teleconference by saying, "The money is basically the same"), the fact is that Ortiz got a significant raise from his previous salary of $80,000 to fight and $80,000 more to win. This has to weigh heavily on the mind of the UFC, Pride, K-1, or anyone else who might consider offering Ortiz a contract in the future. If he has signed contracts in the past that he hasn't honored, how can any company sign him to a multi-fight deal and have full confidence that he's going to honor the contract rather than holding them up and demanding a raise one-third of the way through it?

After his victory over Vitor Belfort at UFC 51, with his UFC contract expired and with his 30th birthday having passed (he previously said he would retire at 30), Ortiz then dropped the bombshell through media interviews that he wanted $350,000 in guaranteed money per fight. It seemed to be nothing more than a case of intentionally pricing himself out of the sport, or not being willing to fight for anything less than a gigantic amount of money, and that's exactly how the major MMA promotions treated it.

:nono:

Way to take yourself out of the sport!

[EnderDeschain]

Alright, damn it. There absolutely should be an MMA thread here in the Sports section, and I'll respond if no one else will. But originally I responded to something you said over in the "Ultimate Fighter" thread, so I'm just gonna cut-and-paste it to here.

You said:
"I was so disappointed in that PPV. I left in a foul mood.

I'm looking forward to the pride PPV because I know that they will telecast ALL of their matches, and they will be all good match ups."

To which I responded:
"What exactly was it that fouled your mood? I thought it was decent enough, definitely better than 50 or 51. The championship matches were great, though short, and I liked St. Pierre against "Mayhem" Miller (I'm starting to like that Canuck more and more). The Lindland fight was okay. I think. I was pretty drunk already, to be quite honest. I taped it, though (of course) and watched the two championship matches over, as well as the St. Pierre / Miller match, and the Cote / Doerksen fight. I was disappointed that Cote lost. I really thought that any other ref would have stopped it and called it to Cote by KO after he sent Doerksen down that one time (either the second or third, can't remember).

Anyway, I wasn't disappointed. I've been thinking about getting that Pride pay-per-view this Saturday, just 'cuz I'm hoping Vitor tears in there and stomps some ass. He's there as an ambassador of the UFC now, Dana White tells us, and I wanna see him shame everyone else. Plus, he's the Phenom, damn it. It's time he started acting like it again."

So, there's that.

As for Ortiz, yeah, that guy's a frickin' idiot. I read about that and just absolutely could not believe it. According to wherever it was that I saw the story, the highest-paid man in the UFC right now (this was a couple weeks ago) is Randy Couture, and he only gets $100 thou a fight, plus a $75 thou win bonus. Ortiz asking 350 is just insane. And I didn't know that about him dropping his price after Couture beat Liddell in 43. It makes absolutely no sense. What made him any less scared of Randy Couture? Moron. I never liked that big-mouth punk, and I was really looking forward to Vitor putting the stomp on his urine-colored noggin. Alas.

So do you think his asking price will go down now that Couture doesn't have the belt anymore? That would be incredibly funny, wouldn't it? Tito certainly had a better showing when he fought Chuck in 47 than he did when he fought Randy in 44. Realistically, Ortiz owed a lot of his loss to the fact that he was stubborn and wanted to stand with Chuck. At least that's how it seemed to me. Randy just owned him, 100%, total domination.

I expect we'll see him back sometime soon. If not the UFC then maybe somewhere else. But not at 350,000 a fight, that's for sure.

[onelegasy]

I don't know if Tito will reappear in UFC. Pride doesn't really want him unless he is fighting under UFC so they can collectively kick his butt.

Dana will not sign Tito for 350k or anything near that. Hell, Tito damn near lost to Vitor, had a bad showing with Patrick Cote, and lost back to back fights before that to the reigning and former champ. Does that scream "Pay me 350K"?? Hell no. Tito should be told to fight shamrock for 50k in a loser leaves UFC match.

I was ticked off with the PPV in general that the fighters I wanted to win, mostly didnt.

And ticked off that Randy lost the way he did.

He should have taken more time after the thumb to the eye.

Right now, Randy should fight Ken Shamrock. THAT would be the best match up IMO.

[onelegasy]

Pride is coming this weekend.

Predictions??

Wanderlei Silva vs. Hidehiko Yoshida

Wandy

Dan Henderson vs. Antonio Rogerio Nogueira

Nogueira

Quinton Jackson vs. Mauricio Rua

Jackson

Igor Vovchanchyn vs. Yuki Kondo

Igor

Kevin Randleman vs. Kazuhiro Nakamura

Kevin

Kazushi Sakuraba vs. Yoon Dong Sik

Saku

Vitor Belfort vs. Alistair Overeem

Vitor

Dean Lister vs. Ricardo Arona

Arona

[EnderDeschain]

Uh...Vitor! Sorry, I don't really know any of these other people. Except Kevin Randleman, who I haven't even seen in a while. I remember him losing to Bas Rutten, that's about it. And I seen in the Ultimate Knockouts thing him getting laid out by Chuck Liddell.

Hey, what the hell happened to Bas Rutten anyway? I'd been wondering that. There was big hype about him when he came into the UFC and then he just kind of went away. Also I saw him on an episode of "The King Of Queens" once, playing a bouncer. Has he gone the way of Oleg and decided to become an "actor"?

[sandman441]

I am not exactly sure about Bas but I think he is an announcer. I know he is doing self defense videos I have seen two of them.

[onelegasy]

Bas does english commentary for the Pride fights, trains, acts on occassions, and teaches self defence type seminars.

[onelegasy]

Payscale of UFC 52 and "TUF-final"

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TUF
-Ken Shamrock - $230 000
-Rich Franklin - $14 000
-Forrest Griffin - $10 000
-Diego Sanchez - $10 000
-Nate Quarry - $10 000
-Josh Koscheck - $10 000
-Chris Leben - $10 000
-Mike Swick - $10 000
-Sam Hoger - $10 000
-Alex Karalexis - $10 000
-Stephen Bonnar - $5000
-Kenny Florian - $5000
-Lodune Sincaid - $5000
-Alex Schoenauer - $5000
-Josh Rafferty - $5000
-Bobby Southworth - $5000
-Chris Sanford - $5000
-Jason Thacker - $5000



UFC52
Randy Couture - $150 000
-Chuck Liddell - $140 000 (70 + 70)
-Matt Hughes - $110 000
-Matt Lindland - $20 000
-Renato Sobral - $20 000
-Georges St-Pierre - $18 000
-Frank Trigg - $14 000
-Patrick Cote - $10 000
-Mike Van Arsdale - $10 000
-Ivan Salaverry - $8000
-Joe Riggs - $4000
-Travis Lutter - $4000
-Joe Doerksen - $4000
-Travis Wiuff - $3000
-John Marsh - $3500
-Jason Miller - $2000

[EnderDeschain]

Holy crap! Randy made 150k on a losing fight? More than the winner? Wow. That just seems kind of wrong. Or I suppose there's some type of championship defense clause there?

I wish I could make $230,000 to slip a couple times and then get knocked the fu** out.

[sandman441]

If you have HDNet I believe it is their is some cage fighting on in a few hours. They are from World Extreme Cagefighting.

[EnderDeschain]

Wow. Boy, that was disappointing. I'll never order a Pride Pay-Per-View again. And it ain't just the fact that Vitor lost (GODDAMNIT!), but that pretty much sucked. I spent the first couple matches sayin' "wow. Pride sucks. Can't wait 'til Vitor comes on." And then... Maybe it was a bad night for them, but this just cements my standing as a UFC guy. Wow. Pride sucks.

[onelegasy]

Well, I will never say that Pride sucks, but this tournament was a disappointment.

Pride holds a tourny for a fight against the champ, and the champ in in the tourny too.

Weird?

Yes.

I lost an AV bet when I bet on Vitor to win. Now I have to use a friggin David Hasselhoff groin shot AV.

However, most Pride events are actually better, way way better than UFC ones

Randy's pay: ya, he made 150k to fight and would have gotten about 100k to win.

Now that Chuck is the champ, he will likely now make 100k to fight and 60-75k to win.

[EnderDeschain]

I lost an AV bet when I bet on Vitor to win. Now I have to use a friggin David Hasselhoff groin shot AV.

:lol: That's frickin' funny. However, Vitor losing... :( That sucks. What happened to him? I think if he'd just let loose a little more, let his hands go and just fight like I know he can, he'd be unstoppable. There's something wrong, you can tell when watching him fight, it's sometimes like his heart's just not in it or something. Like he's not giving it his all. If he keeps up the way he's going, we probably won't see him anymore at all soon. I hate that thought.

I rewatched some of the Pride PPV, and I noticed that even Bas and whoever his co-announcer was were saying that it was a slow event. Unusually so. So I'm thinking maybe I'll give Pride another chance come July. I liked that Mauricio "Shogun" Rua dude. And Wanderlai. I haven't seen much of Wanderlai, so when they showed his highlights before the PPV started, I was rather impressed. That dude looks pretty bad-ass. I would have loved to see him fight the Phenom again, 'cuz I doubt very much that it would go anywhere near the same way, but oh well. I guess it ain't gonna happen.

I was a little confused as to the behavior of the ref. He kept standing the fighters up at what seemed like very odd moments, and moving them around only to put them back in the same position and stuff. Weird. I never realized just how much I'm used to UFC's rules until now. Every time someone would attempt a stomp I'd yell "DISQUALIFIED!" and then have to check myself. And I don't like the fact that they can fight with gi's. I can't even say why I don't, I just don't.

And hey, what's with Phil Baroni, anyway? Is he fighting in Pride now? Not that I'll miss him or anything, I couldn't stand his attitude. And after his losses to Tanner, I think he just lost his steam.

A funny thing, the UFC web-site has the big splash about Arlovski's title defense, but it doesn't say who he'll be defending against. It says that'll be announced later, or something like that. But at 52 they said it would be Justin Eihlers. I'm hoping maybe they just had the wrong information then or something, 'cuz that's not gonna be much of a fight.

Hey, do you think it's right that Rich Franklin jumps down a weight class and automatically gets a title shot? I don't. I think he should have to work his way to number one contendership as a middleweight. Although to be honest, a lot of that might be 'cuz I really like Evan Tanner and don't want to see him lose the belt after having just gotten it. This is not to say I have no faith in Evan, it's just that he's gonna have his work cut out for him.

And what the hell happened to the lightweight division?

[onelegasy]

Vitor ate a knee while he was thinking about what was on channel 2 the day before the fight. After that knee, he was hit with a few good punches by a kick boxer with a lot of power. I was suprised initially that he couldn't get out of the guillotine choke, but when you are dazed and confused..
Vitor has had a lot of losses as of late, and he is going to have to just let his fists fly and go for broke, or retire.

This by far was the slowest paced Pride fight I have ever seen. There were a lot of yellow cards handed out for stalling. A yellow card in pride means the 10% of your purse has been deducted.

The match ups were to blame for a few matches. Rampage vs Shogun was sad to watch because Rampage got his rib broken fairly early in the fight and it was over from them. He told his corner repeatedly that his rib was broken, and they did nothing. As a result, he got a Chute Box beat down.
Shogun looked more impressive than he brother did against Rampage. I think those two will meet again, but Rampage in the meantime has to solve the Brazilian knee problem.

The rules are very different in Pride than they are in UFC.

http://www.pridefc.com/pride2004/about/rules.htm

Baroni got a 3 fight deal with Pride!!!

I have no idea how the heck that happened.

Andre is to fight Justin. How and why: No one else to fight. Ricco can't, Beuntello (sp) is injured, Mir is injured, Sylvia just lost to him.
Does Justin deserve it? Hell no. I'd rather see Wes Simms fight Justin. Andre should fight Tito. Tito should be told that if he wins, he can get his 350k but if he loses, he gets nothing but the boot.

The lightweight division is always overlooked, even though it is a very exciting division. Dana thinks like Vince McMahon in that only big guys draw crowds. It's sad because there are so many good fighters waiting for a chance to shine.

[EnderDeschain]

I can't believe Tank Abbott got a first-round knockout over Cabbage Correira at the Rumble On The Rock Saturday. Did you see Cabbage fight Sylvia and Arlovski? That dude took so much punishment that I thought it was impossible to KO him. Not to mention that Tank didn't look too good against him in their first fight. Notice four out of seven of the winners of that event are from the UFC? Renato Verissimo, Ricco Rodriguez, Kimo, and of course Tank. I really wanted to see this, but it wasn't available on pay-per-view, at least not here. Anybody see the Abbott / Correira fight? I'd love to hear some details.

[onelegasy]

I will be watching the Tank/Cabbage fight tonight.

Cabbage vs Sylvia was so painful to watch.

I was hoping that Cabbage would just go down and end the punishment.

I don't think I have EVER seen that many hard hits to the head.

[EnderDeschain]

Damn, how are you watching it tonight? Is it on somewhere? I suspect it's too late if it is. Yeah, that Cabbage / Sylvia match was painful. I was relieved when they threw in the towel, too.

I heard Cabbage hounded Tank and called him out repeatedly for a rematch, being a pud-smack about it. It's great that Tank won. I'd love to see him come back into the UFC, if they'd put him with the right kind of fighters (like Cabbage). Obviously against Arlovski he wouldn't stand a chance, probably not Sylvia either, but they could match him up with somebody like Justin Eihlers or Mike Kyle and I'd watch it. He's got that whole seasoned-veteran, salty-dog thing going now, and watching him fight some newer heavy-handers would be cool.

[onelegasy]

Well, UFC did some bad matchmaking for their money when they put Tank against Mir.
IMO

Against Kimo, everyone thought it would be a slugfest, but Kimo outsmarted everyone and avoided the exchange and subbed Tank.

Against Cabbage (1st time) it had the makings of an whooping on Tank. The cut saved him a lot of humiliation.

I agree that Tank vs Avloski would be a very bad match up. Against Sylvia or Gan McGee? Now that would be an entertaining fight.

[onelegasy]

The following article was in yesterday's Honolulu Advertiser newspaper...

By Peter Boylan
Advertiser Staff Writer

Police yesterday charged a top Hilo martial artist with first-degree assault after he allegedly punched a police officer outside a Waikiki nightclub hosting a post-event party for Saturday's professional fight card at the Blaisdell Center Arena.

B.J. "The Prodigy" Penn, 26, was arrested early yesterday outside the Zanzabar Night Club on Kuhio Avenue after he allegedly hit Oscar Pauoa, 42, a uniformed police officer who was on a special-duty assignment at a party for the participants of the "Rumble on the Rock 7" mixed martial arts competition.

Penn is the top-ranked welterweight mixed martial arts fighter in MMAFighting.net's world rankings. Mixed martial arts is a combat sport in which competitors may punch, kick, choke, throw and use other techniques.

Police said Pauoa, who was hit in the face, and another officer working at the club had gone outside to break up a fight among a large group of men. Police said the officers used pepper spray to disperse the crowd.

Penn, who police said was in the crowd, allegedly hit Pauoa with a blind-side punch to his left eye and tried to run away, police said. Pauoa ran after Penn and tackled him, but was immediately jumped by several other men in the crowd who tried to pull the officer off Penn, police said.

At that moment, District 6 patrol officers arrived, pulled the men off Pauoa and arrested Penn on suspicion of assaulting a law-enforcement officer in the first degree, a Class C felony.

If convicted, Penn faces up to five years in jail. His bail was set at $20,000.

[onelegasy]

READY FOR A FIREWORK
AS LAWLER TAKES ON
THE PREDATOR!


MONTREAL (CANADA), May 11th, 2005 – Groupe TKO MMA is thrilled to announce that TKO 21: COLLISION will be held at the prestigious Metropolis on June 11th 2005, featuring “THE PREDATOR” PATRICK COTE (6-2-0) versus “RUTHLESS” ROBBIE LAWLER (8-3-0) in the main event of the evening. Also, fresh off his successful K-1 debut, SAM STOUT (6-1-1) is intent on delivering another entertaining mêlée as he continues his ascension up the MMA ranks.

When asked about his opponent, Cote replied that “Lawler better sneak a shovel with him into the ring if he’s expecting to knock me out. On the other hand, when I hit him he’s going to swear as if he has just been hit by a truck. If Nick Diaz was able to knock him out, all I have left to say is oh my!” UFC veteran Robbie Lawler quickly replied to his Canadian opponent “Patrick’s right, I will be bringing a shovel to Montreal; I’ll use it to dig his grave after I’m done with him”.

Cote versus Lawler promises to deliver the kind of fight that all MMA fans long for. These are two of the hardest hitters in the world at the middleweight weight class. Both carry a chip on their shoulders as they enter the ring. Both are still very young and very hungry. When they collide at TKO 21, only one can reassert themselves among the fighting elite.

[EnderDeschain]

The fight card for UFC 53, which will be on June 4th.
Welterweight
Matt Serra vs. Karo Parisyan
Nick Diaz vs. Koji Oishi
Middleweight
David Louiseau vs. Charles McCarthy
Nathan Quarry vs. Shonie Carter
CHAMPIONSHIP: Evan Tanner vs. Rich Franklin
Light Heavyweight
Forrest Griffin vs. Bill Mahood
Heavyweight
Paul Buentello vs. Kevin Jordan
CHAMPIONSHIP: Andrei Arlovski vs. Justin Eilers

That's not too bad a card, although it isn't exactly the most exciting ever. Parisyan and Diaz are both good (although I fu**in hate Diaz), and Serra's pretty good when he's on, too. The welterweight division is quickly stealing the attention in the UFC, thanks mostly to Matt Hughes. I'm really looking forward to a Hughes / St. Pierre rematch, as their last fight had one of the most unexpected finishes ever. Hughes is gonna have his work cut out for him if they go at it again.

I'm looking forward to seeing Quarry fight, and Griffin, of course, but the main draw for this one (for me) is the middleweight belt match, Tanner and Franklin. I really want Evan Tanner to win but damn, I'm scared for him. He didn't look too bad in their first fight, but he didn't look good either. He's not much for striking, and Franklin is. Hopefully the match will last longer than their last one, I at least hope we get that much.

That heavyweight title bout is such a joke. It's like they're saying "here ya go, Andrei, here's some frickin' scrub for you to whoop on until Mir gets better". And I'm really starting to wonder just what the hell is going on with Frank Mir. Is he scared or what? He sure has been out a while due to that motorcycle accident. I can understand if he is scared, Arlovski's a bad motherfu**er right now, and I just don't see who's gonna stop him.

Kind of funny that the guy who knocked out Eilers in February is fighting on the undercard while Eilers gets a title fight. That makes not one iota of sense. But another big reason I'm looking forward to this is they'll be announcing what the main event's gonna be for 54. I'm betting Chuck puts his belt on the line against Babalu. Hughes will be in 54 too, I'm sure, and if he's fighting anyone other than St. Pierre then something's wrong. And hopefully there'll be some lightweight action, damn it! The UFC really needs to get that division going again, it's downright criminal how it's pretty much non-existant right now.

You know I just got the DVD of 51, it just came out, and I could have sworn when I watched it live that Tito Ortiz took that match. But after watching it again a couple times, I'm really starting to wonder if Vitor didn't get robbed. Belfort clearly owned the second round, and Ortiz clearly owned the third, but it's the first that's the sticking point. Really, I think the Phenom should have had it. He just seemed to do more in the first round, I thought.

Ah, Vitor. I sure hope he'll be back soon. Maybe to take on Chuck again, that's something I'd love to see. Although I'd be somewhat stuck on the fence as to who to root for. And for all the sh**-talkin' that Ortiz was doing after that fight, he sure doesn't seem willing to back it up, with his retarded-ass asking price now. Big-mouth little punk, I hate that guy.

[onelegasy]

Predictions:

Welterweight
Matt Serra vs. Karo Parisyan
Nick Diaz vs. Koji Oishi
Middleweight
David Louiseau vs. Charles McCarthy
Nathan Quarry vs. Shonie Carter
CHAMPIONSHIP: Evan Tanner vs. Rich Franklin
Light Heavyweight
Forrest Griffin vs. Bill Mahood
Heavyweight
Paul Buentello vs. Kevin Jordan
CHAMPIONSHIP: Andrei Arlovski vs. Justin Eilers

[EnderDeschain]

I am shocked to discover that I agree with you on pretty much everything, except the Quarry fight. Shonie Carter's been around for a long time, and has an ass-ton of experience under his belt, but I think in some cases that can work against a fighter. It's the whole "hungry young lion" thing, and from what I hear Nate has real potential to hit the big-time. Of course I've never actually seen him fight, so I really can't say, but if I had to put down money I'd put it on Quarry.

[onelegasy]

Well, I like both fighters, but feel that Shonie Carter has the experience to beat Quarry. It should be an entertaining fight either way.

[onelegasy]

Well, I have to say that this PPV was *****ing Awesome.

Even though I was wrong with a few fights, I was severly entertained.

The Crow's spinning kick was amazing.

[EnderDeschain]

It was not bad, but I thought 52 was better. I was thoroughly disappointed in the middleweight championship match. There towards the middle of the fight I thought Tanner was gonna pick up some momentum and win, but then he did exactly what Joe said, got right-hand crazy. I so wanted to jump into my TV and yell at him "what the fu** is wrong with you?! Just take him to the ground, stop trying to stand with him!" He was just getting picked apart in those last two rounds, it was not pretty at all, and he didn't seem to want to change his game plan any. And for some reason I can't define, I just don't like Franklin. But I've always liked Tanner.

Yeah, that Louiseau kick was something. Dana White told Charles McCarthy at the post-press conference that it would have "folded anyone else up like a lawn chair". We'll see much more of Louiseau, I'm sure.

Favorite Moments: Karo Parisyan owning Matt Serra in the last two rounds of their fight. Nate Quarry striking Shonie Carter silly (although it wasn't with quite as much authority I'd have liked; he didn't actually knock Carter down there at the end, Carter just fell). And I can't help it, damn it, Forrest Griffin choking out Mahood. I know Mahood was a scrub they just threw in there for their new poster-boy to beat (according to some), and everyone treated the fight like kind of a gimme, but I still was relieved to see Forrest take it. I like that dude. How can you not?

As for Arlovski / Eilers, that wasn't as decisive as I'd have liked it to be, either. Although it was painfully obvious what was coming, still, I wish Eilers' leg had held out so Andrei could have straight KO'd him. I seriously don't see who's gonna be able to stop that man in the UFC. Frank Mir's in trouble come October (if that pans out).

EDIT: Almost forgot, how 'bout that main event for 54, huh? That is gonna be something. As I recall, you're a bit of a Jeremy Horn fan. It's too bad you're gonna have to watch him get knocked out. :D There's also gonna be Couture / Van Arsdale (another tomato can they're throwing at their other, older poster boy), Georges St. Pierre vs. Frank Trigg (which should be good but why is Trigg getting thrown right back into top contention like that?), and the pay-per-view debut of Diego Sanchez, although I don't think they've announced against who yet. I hope it's Matt Lindland so the Law can stomp a mud-hole in that little punk.

[onelegasy]

Pride Middleweight grand prix this weekend.

[EnderDeschain]

I just watched Pride Bushido 7 on Saturday, the encore pay-per-view for $20. That was a pretty damn good event, I was impressed. I really liked the Jens Pulver fight, and Yves Edwards as well. Baroni was a big-mouth, as usual, and by the end of the fight I really thought he was just gonna fall down on his own. And I don't like that Gomi guy already.

I'll be watching Critical Countdown. But it's next weekend, according to the Pride site and InDemand. July 1st. I'm looking forward to seeing Wanderlei fight again (until April's Total Elimination, I had only seen his 45-second fight with Vitor). It'll be good to see Pedro Rizzo too, the UFC kind of abandoned him. And finally I'll get to see CroCop in action, after hearing all the ranting and raving people do about him. I just hope this one's better than the last one, which sucked.

[onelegasy]

You didn't like the "Gomi Rage Attack"?

He's a classy little **** head. I can't wait for Yves to knock him out.

Bushido 7 was awesome.

Line up for Pride:

*Vanderlei Silva vs. Kazuhiro Nakamura
-*Ricardo Arona vs. Kazushi Sakuraba
-*Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira vs. Pawel Nastula
-*Kiyoshi Tamura vs. Makoto Takimoto
-*Mirko CroCop vs. Ibragim Magomedov
-*Igor Vovchanchyn vs. Alistair Overeem
-Mauricio "Shogun" Rua vs. *Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
-*Sergei Kharitonov vs. Pedro Rizzo

* = my prediction

[EnderDeschain]

Was it just me or was that Shogun decision horsesh**?

Old dude shouldn't have taken off his half-gi while fighting Wanderlai. Dumb-ass.

CroCop is fu**in fast. He didn't throw much during that fight, but good golly, are his hands quick. I was thoroughly impressed.

I'll be getting the next one.

Damn, I was really rooting for Pedro Rizzo. But sheesh, about a minute into the fight I saw that it was pretty much done, he was through. Oh, how they fall.

God, Pride's commentators suck. Bas and his homedude need to pack it up and go home, seriously. And where's the clock in the bottom right corner? Why is the crowd so subdued? Folks can talk all the smack they want about UFC's fighters not being able to contend, but really, how many people does Chuck Liddell have to knock out before people stop calling him "lucky"? One loss avenged (Couture), one more pretty much in the bag (Horn), so bring it, Rampage. Isn't he a free agent now? I heard UFC offered him fights against both Liddell and Couture and he turned them down. Smart man.

EDIT: Was a little drunk, said some silly go-UFC crap. But Pride's not bad. I'm really looking forward to seeing CroCop fight again in August. I thought it was kind of funny how at the end they had Wandy and Shogun posing together and all, with Alistair Overeem and Ricardo Arona just standing off to the side being pretty much ignored. It's obvious who Pride wants to see clash in the final match-up. That August event seems like it's gonna be good, with the Middleweight and Heavyweight championships both. August is gonna be a good month for MMA fans. There's Ultimate Fight Night on the sixth, UFC 54 on the 20th, Ultimate Fighter season two premiering on the 22nd, and Pride on what, the 27th? Kick-ass. And there's still Bushido 8 in three weeks.

By the way, I watched that first Chuck Liddell / Jeremy Horn fight, and the Iceman really wasn't doing so bad. He was a little sloppy on the ground, and it seemed like he gave some openings that Horn didn't take in addition to the one he did, but that was a long time ago, after all. Plus it was when UFC still had that 12-minute regulation time, and it went the whole way. Chuck never tapped, just kind of went out. Horn's gonna get beat next month (although I will retract my little drunken "it's in the bag" comment from earlier; it's gonna be a fight, for sure).

And seriously, Pride needs to get some new play-by-play guys. Bas is just horrible, and his cohort isn't much better at all. A buddy of mine said during the event last night that there should be a pay-per-view option to disable the commentary and just hear the ring noise and what-not. I agree. It really makes me appreciate Rogan and Goldie.

[EnderDeschain]

Anyone who's interested in getting into UFC should tune in to Spike TV tonight (July 25th) and watch "UFC Unleashed". They're gonna reshow the Forrest Griffin / Stephan Bonnar fight from April's finale, which is a great slug-fest. There's also gonna be a couple knockouts, and who doesn't love knockouts? More people need to start watching, damn it! And the Spike TV stuff is free so you've got no excuse.

[EnderDeschain]

Okay. This is the last time I'm gonna shamelessly bump this thread and plug this sport, I swear, so don't get mad at me, mods. I just want everyone to know that tonight on Spike TV is the first-ever UFC Ultimate Fight Night event. It's three hours, it's live, and it's gonna kick ass. This is like a pay-per-view, what the rest of us have been giving $30 every couple months to see, for absolutely free. And hey, if you like Fear Factor, Joe Rogan is one of the ring-side commentators (I like the guy, he's funny). So for fu**'s sake, come on, someone else start watching this stuff so I can talk about it here. No, I don't wanna go to some other message board to discuss MMA, damn it, this is the only boards I go to and I intend to keep it that way. But I absolutely love MMA, and wanna discuss it. So watch, damn it, watch! You won't regret it.

That is all.

[onelegasy]

I'm Back!

I watched that UFC fight night and thought that it rocked.

Most of the matches were entertaining.

Hopefully this draws more people to watch UFC

[sandman441]

I was going to watch it but forgot. I did end up watching Pride fighting championship on a fox sports channel but I missed most of it I saw about a match and a half. What I saw I liked though. And don't forget Ultimate Fighter 2 is on after Raw.

[EnderDeschain]

Goddamn! It's about time. Glad you're back, both of you. Just when I was about to stop even checking the Sports forum.

UFN was pretty good, for the most part. I think the fight of the night was definitely Bonnar / Hoger. Followed by Leben / Cote. The main event was a little slow, but if it weren't for the fact that there were heaps of expectations on it, it wouldn't have been such a bad fight. I for one was expecting Marquardt to be a lot more aggressive than he was, after all the stuff I'd been hearing. Salaverry played defense but I kind of expected that. All I know is that Ivan getting dropped from the UFC's roster is horsesh**.

How 'bout Boiling Point, huh? That was one good-ass pay-per-view. I was disappointed that Diego didn't get owned, but it was obvious they picked Gassaway 'cuz they knew Diego would beat him. The guy had nothing on the ground, and with Diego you know that's where it's probably gonna end up. Couture seemed a little slow on his striking against Van Arsdale, and it kind of looked like he's lost a little bit of his chin. He got stunned a couple times. But still, he dominated the fight and I was damn glad to see it. His wrestling hasn't deteriorated any, but he just didn't seem as good at the stand-up. It kind of worries me that a rubber match with Liddell would go exactly the same as their last fight. I'm an Iceman fan, and even I don't wanna see that. I'd like to see Randy give Chuck a run for his money, at least.

Georges St. Pierre. Wow. 'Nuff said.

And ah, Jeremy Horn. I gotta be honest, I was extremely worried coming into this that Chuck might not retain his belt. Maybe it was the special Spike TV was running to build it up (which was awesome), maybe it's Horn's amazing record, or maybe it was the way all the hardcore fans seem to think the world of him, but I really thought he might have Liddell's number. About two minutes into the first round I stopped worrying. I was a little disappointed that Chuck didn't shut him down sooner, but it was a great fight.

Matt Lindland better get a damn shot at Franklin next. If he doesn't I'm boycotting.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to Pride this weekend. I only saw CroCop fight in the last pay-per-view, that's all I've ever seen of him, but I was impressed. Fedor, I've never seen him fight but I've heard loads about him. I'm more interested in that than the finale of the middleweight GP. I missed the Pride thing on FSN, I meant to watch it but never really looked into when it was showing.

It's been a good month. Now, with TUF 2 starting tonight, I get a fight every week. That is awesome. From what I hear the caliber of fighters is much better this season, and just about everything about the show's gonna be better. I hope this is true. We'll find out in a few hours, I guess.

[sandman441]

I don't get to watch UFC alot so I really can't respond to too many things. I don't like the idea to pay to watch it either I was a wrestling fan for probably 20 some odd years and maybe ordered 5 PPV's. But with ultimate fighter on again I should become more frequent in this thread. Actually HDNET hasn't been showing too much cage fighting maybe they pick up UFC or Pride Fighting. We have a local I think it's similar to UFC but Diego Sanchez is supposed to be here for the next show which is close to every month. I am going to Vegas on the 5th and was a little disappointed that the PPV was a few weeks before I leave but I probably wouldn't go because tickets are a little pricy.

[onelegasy]

Pride Final Conflict PPV Premiere Date: Sunday, August 28th, 2005


Fight Card

The Semi-Finals and Finals of the Middleweight Tournament

Wanderlei Silva (Brazil) vs. Ricardo Arona (Brazil)
Mauricio "Shogun" Rua (Brazil) vs. Alistair Overeem (Holland)
Winner Silva/Arona vs. Winner Rua/Overeem

Heavyweight Championship Match

Fedor Emelianenko (Russia) vs. Mirko "Cro Cop" Filipovic (Croatia)
(Champion) (Challenger)

Additional Matches

David "Tank" Abbott (USA) vs. Hidehiko Yoshida (Japan)
Igor Vovchanchyn (Ukraine) vs. Kazuhiro Nakamura (Japan)
Fabricio Werdum (Brazil/Spain) vs. Roman Zentsov (Russia)

This will be an awesome PPV.

I'm actually going for Tank to win against Hidehiko.

Wanderlei will KO Arona because Arona fights with his chin way up in the air.

Shogun and Overeem will go the distance and Shogun is going to be too tired from that to put up a good fight against Silva.

If anyone is going to beat CroCop, it's Fedor. He's watched all of Mirko's fights and knows what he has to do. However, Mirko could get lucky. Either way, this fight is not going to make it to the second round.

Igor has something to prove after his very quick loss to Overeem at the last ppv. I expect him to tko Nakamura.

Werdum has mad submission skills and this will be over in the first round.

[onelegasy]

From MMA WEEKLY

-Jeremy Horn was medically suspended for eight weeks, which is a longer suspension than many KO victims get. For example, Gideon Ray was KO'ed at the Ultimate Fight Night event on August 6th, but he was only medically suspended for four weeks, not eight. The longer-than-normal suspension for Horn is likely the result of the commission being concerned with his vision problems during and after his fight with Chuck Liddell.

If you watch the tape of the fight, you can see that several punches landed on or near Horn's cheek-bones and eyes in the flurry that accompanied the knockdown in the first round. Immediately after this flurry, Horn can clearly be seen rubbing his left eye. From that point on, Horn's left eye and the area surrounding it are very red, and the area only gets more red as the fight goes on and he takes more punches.

Anyone who questions Horn's heart due to the fact that he verbally submitted in the fourth round is severely misguided and detached from reality, as the fact of the matter is that Horn fought three full rounds with blurred vision, at great personal risk to his own health, in the hopes of winning the UFC Light-Heavyweight Title. When it finally got to the point where he could barely see at all in the fourth round, he gave up, which is something that many fighters would have done in the first round as soon as they started experiencing blurred vision.

While the athletic commission's doctors were concerned enough with Horn to give him a longer-than-normal suspension of eight weeks, it should be seen as good news that they didn't feel the need to suspend him for a longer period of time, like six months. All the punishment that Horn took around his eyes could have easily led to a broken orbital bone, which Horn is fortunate to have avoided..

[sandman441]

I am still a little disappointed that I didn't get to watch the PPV live but I am going to be missing a NHL game also I should have picked better dates for Vegas.

[EnderDeschain]

I give Horn all the credit in the world for standing in there with Chuck as long as he did. I think people are sort of downing on him because of the fact that he "guaranteed" he'd have the belt at the end of the night, because the build-up made it out like Chuck was at least gonna get the fight of his life. And Horn got in there and got owned. Maybe it was those punches in the first round that totally screwed him up for the remaining three, but he just had nothing going at any time in the fight. The guy has to be good, with his record and the respect he gets from other fighters, but his performance was a bit anticlimactic. Still, he has nuts the size of truck tires, no one can argue that. And I did notice while the fight was going on that he kept swiping at his eye. I thought it was 'cuz there was blood in it or something.

Once again I can't really argue or agree over anything in Pride. I can't even form an opinion on Tank's fight, even though I've watched him fight since Oleg Taktarov choked him out.

Fu**, I just looked up his opponent. Four wins, all by submission? I sure hope Tank's learned a thing or two since he fought Mir and Kimo after his not-so-grand comeback. I love that he knocked out Cabbage, and even though I used to hate Tank back in the day, I'd like to see him keep winning now. He's old-school, and while he's a bit of a throwback from today's highly-tuned athletes, I think he could have a place now if he'd just get matched up right.

I could have swore I read not too long ago that Vitor was going to be fighting again in this one. I guess not. I hope the UFC picks him back up.

[onelegasy]

Pride Predictions?

[sandman441]

I've only seen 1 Pride show and they were highlights so no predictions from me.

[EnderDeschain]

I predict that if Fedor loses everyone will say it's 'cuz he's injured. That's my only prediction. Whether or not he'll lose, I have no idea, 'cuz I've never seen the man fight, and have seen CroCop once. But even being someone who's never really gotten into Pride, even I'm excited for this fight. The way everyone's going on about it, it's gonna be the best thing in the history of recorded time. My other prediction is that people will be disappointed in it. I hope I'm wrong, I'm prepared to be impressed.

Wanderlei's gonna win, and then he'll fight Chuck Liddell. Ha! Yeah, right. Like that's gonna happen. Well, the Wandy winning part probably will, but the fighting Chuck won't. As for Tank, I'm leaning toward disagreeing with you, Legasy. I watched that 18-minute interview they've got with him on Sherdog, and he just didn't really sound like he gives a sh** about this fight at all. He's already making the "short-notice" excuse, which is valid, sure, but it sounds to me like he's preparing a reason to lose. And we all know how he typically fares against a ground opponent (the guy saying he wants to brawl with Tank is horsesh**, he's gonna shoot immediately I bet). Again, I hope I'm wrong about this, too.

And oh yeah, what the hell is this doing airing on a Sunday? That sucks. Now I'm gonna feel like total crap on Monday. I've gotta get absolutely smashed on any given fight night, it's like a rule. Then I rewatch the tape later.

[onelegasy]

I predict that if Fedor loses everyone will say it's 'cuz he's injured. That's my only prediction. Whether or not he'll lose, I have no idea, 'cuz I've never seen the man fight, and have seen CroCop once. But even being someone who's never really gotten into Pride, even I'm excited for this fight. The way everyone's going on about it, it's gonna be the best thing in the history of recorded time. My other prediction is that people will be disappointed in it. I hope I'm wrong, I'm prepared to be impressed.

Wanderlei's gonna win, and then he'll fight Chuck Liddell. Ha! Yeah, right. Like that's gonna happen. Well, the Wandy winning part probably will, but the fighting Chuck won't. As for Tank, I'm leaning toward disagreeing with you, Legasy. I watched that 18-minute interview they've got with him on Sherdog, and he just didn't really sound like he gives a sh** about this fight at all. He's already making the "short-notice" excuse, which is valid, sure, but it sounds to me like he's preparing a reason to lose. And we all know how he typically fares against a ground opponent (the guy saying he wants to brawl with Tank is horsesh**, he's gonna shoot immediately I bet). Again, I hope I'm wrong about this, too.

And oh yeah, what the hell is this doing airing on a Sunday? That sucks. Now I'm gonna feel like total crap on Monday. I've gotta get absolutely smashed on any given fight night, it's like a rule. Then I rewatch the tape later.


I have the results, but will wait for you to watch it.

[EnderDeschain]

Oh thank god. I almost didn't come into this thread to see what you posted 'cuz I was afraid you'd talk about it. I've been avoiding Sherdog like the plague today. I hate this taped broadcast sh**, but I guess it's necessary with them half-way across the world.

[EnderDeschain]

That was a damn good heavyweight championship fight. Once it got into the second round, though, it just looked like CroCop had too much taken out of him. I guess a huge fu**er like Fedor laying on top of you'll do that. Even though I don't really know either figher that well, I wanted CroCop to win, just 'cuz I like the guy. Too bad.

Tank looked like sh**, no surprise there.

I could not believe the whooping that Shogun put on Arona. I also could not believe that Wanderlei got knocked off when he did. I was actually rooting for Shogun by the final. Pretty good event, really.

EDIT: I just discovered some DVD release dates on the UFC's website, and thought I'd share 'em. UFC 52 comes out on September 20th, and 53 comes out December 27th. But most importantly, and something I'd been wondering about, is season one of the Ultimate Fighter, which will be released on November 1st. I just wonder what will be included in that, will it have the finale, complete with Franklin / Shamrock? I guess we'll see.

[onelegasy]

Fedor is a mutant machine. I love the guy and hate Mirko CrocPot more than you can imagine.

Finally the question has been answered and I hope the Mirko bandwagon slows down.

The only way someone is going to beat Fedor is if they cut him badly.

Shogun was amazing.

Once again Arona was being woken up from the mat.


I was disappointed with Igor...

[onelegasy]

Confessions of a sore loser:

Pride: Do you want to have a rematch with Silva for the Middleweight Championship?
Arona: Of course. That's the most important thing.
Pride: When is your next fight?
Arona: It hasn't been definitely decided yet but it's important that I fight Silva in a title match for the Middleweight Championship first. Then, a rematch with Shogun. The fight with Silva was tough and I hit my head in the 1 st minute of the Final Round, which hurt me. I want to fight Shogun when I'm not like that.
Pride: When did you hit your head?
Arona: I tried to take Shogun down in the first minute of the fight. I grabbed his legs and tried to take him down to the mat but I went down first and Shogun came down on top of me, sandwiching me. I lost control (of the fight) then. My fight was over at that point. When regained my senses, I was surprised because he had my right arm in an omo-plata.
Pride: Where do you think Shogun is strong?
Arona: As I just said, the fight ended when he was came down on top of me. Shogun was moving around wildly after that. I couldn't control the fight when I hit my head during the takedown.

[EnderDeschain]

What a loser. I didn't like that guy almost immediately upon seeing him. Especially after that shouting in Wandy's face at the end of their fight. If you're gonna have attitude, fine, but it ain't like he knocked him out or anything. I wouldn't call a decision victory something to get all "IN YOUR FACE, BIT*H!" about. I'd pay to see a rematch with that clown against either Wandy or Shogun.

[onelegasy]

"In other news related to the UFC on Spike TV, World Wrestling Entertainment has fired back at Zuffa and Spike. Following the news that Spike TV will air a live UFC fight special on Monday, October 3rd in WWE Raw's timeslot on Spike TV (which will go head-to-head with WWE's return to USA Network), WWE officially announced today that it is pulling out the big guns for its October 3rd show.

In an official statement, WWE said, "Many former WWE Champions will be making their return to Raw on October 3rd, including Hall of Famer Hulk Hogan, Stone Cold Steve Austin, Mick Foley, and Triple H. Even Mr. McMahon himself will make an appearance." The press release referred to the October 3rd episode of Raw as a "star-studded, historic night," and the show itself is being billed, "A Night of Champions."

While it's obvious that any first-run show put on by WWE is going to crush any UFC show head-to-head in the overall ratings, that alone is not enough for WWE. The UFC could take a very significant chunk of WWE's young male audience on that night, and WWE is pulling out all the stops to make sure that doesn't happen.

There's no doubt that even if Spike TV wasn't putting the UFC head-to-head with Raw on October 3rd, WWE would still have tried to make a big deal out of the October 3rd episode of Raw on USA Network. However, there can also be little doubt that the head-to-head battle with the UFC, along with the huge amount of hard feelings that exist between Spike TV executives and WWE executives, are also contributing factors in WWE's decision to hot-shot so many big returns on a single episode of a TV series that runs 52 weeks per year.

When WWE Raw moved from USA Network to Spike TV (then known as TNN) several years ago, the first week of Spike ratings were almost identical to the final week of USA ratings. Historically, when a pro wrestling show changes networks, pro wrestling fans have always been able to "find" the wrestling show that they want to watch (whereas many other kinds of TV shows experience big ratings drop-offs when they switch to a different network).

So, just the fact that WWE Raw is moving from Spike TV to USA Network is not reason enough for WWE to blow so many potential ratings-popping appearances in one night. The company's ill will towards Spike TV, and even more so its fear of losing a chunk of its young male demographic, are likely what is driving WWE to pull out all the stops on October 3rd"

[sandman441]

I know what I will be watching on the 3rd and it's not the WWE. Wrestling has been terrible lately I haven't watched it for about a month or two.

[EnderDeschain]

Wrasslin' is a joke. When I turn on the TV to watch "The Ultimate Fighter" every Monday night I catch the last couple minutes of Raw beforehand, and it makes me laugh my ass off. I just don't understand why anyone would watch that crap, the appeal of it is something that's completely beyond me. However I realize that it's fans are loyal and rabid, so probably not many of them are going to defect to Spike TV and the UFC, but I don't see anyone who gives the UFC a fighting chance at their attention ending up with their TV's on the WWF. I just hope UFN2 gets a solid chunk of ratings, regardless of how McMahon's circus scores or doesn't. The Tanner / Louiseau main event should be good, and having Bonnar, Koscheck, and Leben on the card will help.

[sandman441]

For me it's the high spots but the WWE toned it down so much their matches mostly suck. I was a WWF fan before a UFC/MMA fan I watch WWE a little bit but I am not into it all that much anymore I think the McMahons are trying to get away from wrestling and go into something else.

[onelegasy]

I'm not sure McMahon knows what to do anymore.

The cruiseweight class had toned down all their crowd pleasing moves. Too many women on the show. Storylines are a joke and its' the same wrestling moves over and over again.

Maybe with competition, WWE will look at putting the wrestling back into WWE.

[sandman441]

I'm not sure McMahon knows what to do anymore.

I don't think he does either and Stephanie doesn't know either

The cruiseweight class had toned down all their crowd pleasing moves. Too many women on the show. Storylines are a joke and its' the same wrestling moves over and over again.

Yeah that is why I got disinterested again. You really can't tone down their style all that much

Maybe with competition, WWE will look at putting the wrestling back into WWE.


I doubt it jeff jarrett I think has too big of an ego to let anybody hold the title for more than a few months before he gets it again.

[onelegasy]

I've never watched TNA though i have heard that their cruiserweight is phenominal.

With UFC becoming more accessible on TV; I think more people will tune in to see the "real thing" and shift away from "sports entertainment"

[sandman441]

I've never watched TNA though i have heard that their cruiserweight is phenominal.

With UFC becoming more accessible on TV; I think more people will tune in to see the "real thing" and shift away from "sports entertainment"


It's hard to say but you could be right because wrestling is pretty bad right now. I think if this was 5 or so years ago UFC wouldn't be on tv. TNA is allright it's definately more entertaining wrestling wise than WWE.

[onelegasy]

Did anyone watch TUF 2 last night?

My girlfriend was watching the fight and even she commented how much these guys stalled and generally sucked.

Dana was (rightfully) pissed at both fighters after that horrible exhibition.

I never want to see either one of them again.

[sandman441]

I saw it. I think there was a couple of reasons it kind of sucked. I still don't know most of the fighters names but the guy with the hurt knee was hurt more than anybody thought. Or they just didn't want to fight each other. It was almost a boxing match but without too many punches thrown and a whole lot of hugging.

[onelegasy]

Imagine if that were a ppv match..

[EnderDeschain]

No kiddin'. Anybody who says Matt Lindland is boring because he goes to the ground needs to watch that fight. It was ten times as boring as any Lindland match, and they stayed on their feet for most of it. I hope Rashad gets knocked out week after next, and after that I never see either of those fighters again.

[onelegasy]

Hey, I just realized that you also post in my stomping grounds (sherdog)

I was thinking that I recognized that Avatar from somewhere.

lol

[EnderDeschain]

Yeah, for the longest time I was determined to not talk about MMA anywhere but here. No offense to you guys, but there's only so much the three of us can talk about. I finally broke down and said screw it, I'll start posting at Sherdog.

This is shaping up to be a good couple months. That October 3rd card looks a little flat, but that's okay. The next UFC pay-per-view is kind of crappy, but that's okay too. I'll take a crappy card over no card any day. November is when the good stuff should happen, have you seen the rumored card for UFC 56? There's not a bad fight on it yet. It should be kick-ass.

No Bushido on pay-per-view, at least not with my cable company. That sucks. I can't believe that Baroni, Edwards, and Pulver all got knocked off already. I was really hoping Yves would go all the way. Oh well.

A lot of people are complaining about Arona's immediate rematch with Wanderlei at the next Pride, but I'm looking forward to it. CroCop and Barnett as well. I was really hoping that after losing against Fedor, Mirko would defect and come to the UFC. Yeah, right. It would be cool, but I know it'd never happen.

[onelegasy]

I really don't like Mirko at all so he can suck his thumb for awhile.

I hope Josh GnP's him to a victory.

[EnderDeschain]

Well, Ultimate Fight Night 2 was disappointing. The Koscheck fight was just as sucky as his fight with Leben. I was glad to see him get kneed into a loss, but I gotta give him respect for not tapping out on that choke. He went out instead of tapping, that's pretty impressive.

That heavyweight fight with Vera was bad. One cool knee doesn't make up for a round and a half of suckage. I wonder if Dana's starting to realize that these lethargic, low-gas heavyweights are not gonna cut it. He really needs to figure out some way to fix that division.

The second-best fight of the night was Leben's. I called it to Leben by first-round KO, as I haven't been impressed with Dewees' chin in what I've seen of him, but the submission is fine, too. That was an odd finish, though, there was almost no reaction at all from either fighter or the crowd.

And Evan Tanner. Damn it. Good fight, but damn it. I called this to Loiseau by second-round TKO, but when it started I thought Tanner looked better than I'd seen him in a while, and began hoping I was wrong. He owned the first round and was pretty dominating, causing said hopes to further blossom. It seemed to me he could have had the Rear Naked Trigg a couple of times, but I've never tried to put it on someone so I don't know how tough it is to sink. Then once Loiseau started landing those elbows in the second, I kind of figured it would be over soon. Tanner's a bleeder, and even though the guy absolutely will not quit he usually doesn't perform as well once he's hurt. So even though I called it dead-on, I was still disappointed. I like Evan and really hope we haven't seen the last of him, and am now on the anti-Loiseau bandwagon. Fu** that guy. Yes, it's a stupid way to look at things and I won't try to take away from his ability, but I want to see him lose now. Sorry, I hold a grudge.

All in all, it was kind of flat. The last two fights were good, but I don't think this one measured up well against the first UFN, which was pretty decent in spite of it's disappointing main event.

[sandman441]

It's still going on so I skipped the Leben fight but I don't like Vale he's saying he is going to be a champion and he was what one UFC fight? I was hoping he would lose bad. Koscheck is getting better but he still lays and prays a little bit too much but he is getting better.


The second-best fight of the night was Leben's. I called it to Leben by first-round KO, as I haven't been impressed with Dewees' chin in what I've seen of him, but the submission is fine, too. That was an odd finish, though, there was almost no reaction at all from either fighter or the crowd.


That was pretty weird I kind of wished Leben would have knocked him out but that's because I didn't like the guy (I've never heard of half of these fighters).

[onelegasy]

Hmm.

I rather enjoyed UFN2.

No fights went to the decision, and were mostly entertaining. Dewee's was shocked that he got caught in a sub as he was clearly not expecting it from Leben. He had ZERO respect for him on the ground and paid the price.

I really don't like Koscheck and was quite happy to see the knee that took him out.

I thought the final match was awesome. 4 times Tanner had the Crow's back and his defence was amazing. Each time I thought "Oh crap" it's rear naked choke time, and he got out every time.

Those freakin elbows are amazing.

I gave the event an 8/10

[EnderDeschain]

I guess I was too excited about it, and maybe expected too much. Plus I didn't drink, and any time I don't drink for an event it completely changes my perception of it. There didn't seem to be as many commercials this time, at least. I think the Koscheck fight is what set me off into a bad vibe, 'cuz it was boring. Sorry, I know there's a lot of people who think it wasn't or whatever, but to me it was fu**in boring. Every time Josh shot you knew exactly what he was gonna do with it once he got him down. Lay there. Throw some weak-ass rib shots. Lay there some more. It was a bad start, followed by a bad continuation with that Vera fight. I haven't rewatched them yet, so maybe they weren't as bad as I remember, but the general taste left in my mouth was not good. The last two fights, however, were. I still say it was a little flat, somehow.

EDIT: I almost forgot to post my official predictions for the pay-per-view Friday. I wish I had done so for UFN 2, as I called the Tanner / Loiseau fight dead on. The Leben fight I got the right winner and the right round, but the wrong finish, and the Koscheck / Fickett fight I got all fu**ed up (I called it third-round TKO to Koscheck). Anyway, Friday (the first guy = winner):

Chris Lytle - Joe Riggs / Rd. 2 / KO
Jorge Rivera - Dennis Hallman / Rd. 3 / Decision
Renato "Babalu" Sobral - Chael Sonnen / Rd. 1 / TKO
Forrest Griffin - Elvis Sinosic / Rd. 2 / Submission
Andrei Arlovski - Paul Buentello / Rd. 1 / However AA decides to end it. Judging by Buentello's King Of The Cage stuff, he's completely outclassed here. He's a competent striker, but doesn't have much else to challenge Arlovski with, and what fight does that remind you of? (AA vs. Sylvia) I think Andrei's gonna do whatever he wants in this fight.

The other three fights on the card are full of guys I've either never seen fight or never heard of, so I can't make predictions on them.

[sandman441]

the Koscheck / Fickett fight I got all fu**ed up (I called it third-round TKO to Koscheck). Anyway, Friday (the first guy = winner):



His fight was boring but the knee I think brought it up a little bit because that came out of nowhere. Koscheck is getting a little better but he needs to get the wrestling out of him that is the reason why he lost because he rarely ever did anything when he was on top. I don't have any predictions again I don't know too many people except for Forrest Griffin, and Andrei Arlovski. but I don't know that much about Arlovski except that his match last night. I hope Forrest wins though.

[onelegasy]

Chris Lytle - Joe Riggs / Rd. 2 / KO
Jorge Rivera - Dennis Hallman / Rd. 3 / Decision
Renato "Babalu" Sobral - Chael Sonnen / Rd. 1 / TKO
Forrest Griffin - Elvis Sinosic / Rd. 2 / Submission
Andrei Arlovski - Paul Buentello / Rd. 1 / However AA decides to end it.

My predictions:

Lytle - decision
Hallman - Rd 2 sub
Sobral - Decision
Griffin - Rd 2 sub
Arlovski - Rd 1 TKO

[EnderDeschain]

Well, the only prediction I got completely wrong was the Lytle / Riggs fight. Riggs ended up winning in the second round by TKO, cut.

Rivera / Hallman I got right, but that wasn't as good a fight as I thought it would be. Jorge just doesn't follow up very well when he should, I thought he could have ended the fight a few times and didn't. I kind of wonder how much of a future he has with the UFC.

I actually thought Babalu might be in trouble against Sonnen once things got going. That was a damn good fight. Chael Sonnen had more than I expected him to, and the fact that he survived having Babalu all over his ankle like that was amazing. Babalu won, by triangle choke in the second round. I might call this the best fight of the night, I don't know, I was very drunk and will have to rewatch the whole thing before really determining that.

Forrest and Elvis was a pretty good fight, too. Elvis also showed more than I expected him to, especially on his feet. The guy's a pretty good striker, his accuracy was good and it looked to me like he had Forrest rocked a couple times. Forrest wins by TKO in the first, but I for one thought the stoppage might have been a little premature. In the replay it was clear that Sinosic was in serious danger and about to get trounced on, but it still shouldn't have been stopped where it was, I don't think.

Which brings us to the Arlovski fight. That was one weird fu**in finish. First-round knockout for Andrei to retain his belt, but man it was a strange knockout. When Big John stopped it I was like "WHAT?! What the hell just happened?!" Then they showed the replay and yeah, Buentello was definitely out like a light, his whole body went slack and he just fell onto AA's back like a sack of potatoes. The positioning was strange, but it was definitely a knockout and definitely needed to be stopped.

All in all it wasn't a bad event. Sean Gannon ended up being pretty disappointing after all the hype around him. He didn't belong there in the first place, but I don't see that as a knock on this card at all. It wasn't the best UFC ever, but it wasn't the worst either.

[sandman441]

Good news that Forrest won.

[onelegasy]

This interview is too funny:

- BOSTON HERALD RECAP ON GANNON
Wednesday, October 12, 2005 - Boston Herald

Click to Review

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cannon is ultimately taken out
By Mark Murphy

UNCASVILLE, Conn. - The end was bloody, and it came quickly.

Sean ``The Cannon'' Gannon, taken down early in the first round by powerful Brandon Lee Hinckle, lost his Ultimate Fighting championship debut by a TKO with 1:14 left in the round last night.

After absorbing repeated rights and elbows to the head and punishing knees to the ribs, Gannon, the 35-year-old Boston policeman, had a wide gash beneath his right eye.

Hinckle, a former collegiate wrestler who developed his mixed martial arts skills in Korea and Japan, said, ``I showed I'm the hardest puncher in the world.''

Judging from the amount of Gannon's blood on the canvas, Hinckle was being modest.

Gannon, fighting on the undercard of the UFC heavyweight championship bout between defending champ Andrei Arlovski and Paul Buentello at Mohegan Sun Arena, only hopes that his quick elimination doesn't hurt his chance of receiving another bout.

``It's up to them,'' he said. ``I hope they do let me fight again and give me the time I need to develop my skills. My grappling is not up to the skills that they have at this level, but it's still my dream. This is what I want.''

Though he wrestled in high school, the ground skills necessary to survive in the UFC were not part of Gannon's arsenal last night.

``(Hinckle) was too good a wrestler,'' Gannon said. ``He had a lot of skills, and when he took me down, I couldn't keep him off of me.

``But I still believe I can compete at this level. I just have to pick myself up now and go back to the drawing board. I know what it is that I have to do. I just hope they give me the time to do it.''

[EnderDeschain]

Riiight. Dream on, Gannon. I'm pretty sure that dude's done in the UFC.

I read an article somewhere lately (can't remember where) that had Babalu more or less calling out Forrest Griffin, saying that he not only wanted to fight Forrest but to knock him out. That's a fight I would love to see. I'd put money on Babalu.

I'm pretty stoked about Nick Diaz / Diego Sanchez at the TUF2 finale. I really hope Diaz puts the hurtin' on Sanchez.

[EnderDeschain]

Just got done watching Pride 30. I was a bit let down by CroCop, even though he won he just wasn't very impressive. I was also disappointed that Shamrock went out the way he did. Was it a qualified stoppage? I think so, yeah, but a case can be made either way. It was a pretty disappointing pay-per-view overall, especially the two main events.

[onelegasy]

I missed this ppv, and judging by what I've read, I won't be rushing to watch it.

I think Shamrock is finally done.

[EnderDeschain]

Bah to you, I say BAH! I like Ken Shamrock, despite his WWF excursion. If he's gotta go (which I know he does eventually), then I'd like to see him go out on a high note, with a W. Preferably against that punk-ass Tito.

Did you hear about Parisyan pulling out of the November 19th fight? Man, does that ever suck. I was so looking forward to that. I had no doubt (well, almost no doubt) that Matt Hughes would end up winning, but stylistically it was an interesting match-up anyway. Now it's supposedly Joe Riggs who's gonna take on Mr. Hughes. I hope Riggs gets his ass beat, I can't stand that guy. If he pulls an upset and takes Matt's belt...man, that would really turn the division on it's ear, wouldn't it? St. Pierre versus Joe Riggs? That's actually a pretty exciting prospect.

I don't know how true it is, but there's rumors flying about that Vitor Belfort may fight none other than Shogun Rua on Pride's New Year's Eve show. On one hand I really hope this is true. On the other hand, I don't. If it does happen, all I got to say is WAR VITOR!!!!
(I hate it when Sherdoggers do that, but I couldn't resist :D)

[onelegasy]

I bet on Vitor winning against Overeem and he sucked. I swore never to bet on Vitor again.

War Shogun!

[EnderDeschain]

Unfortunately it turned out to be a completely untrue rumor. Gosh darn it. Yeah, it's pretty unlikely that Vitor would beat Shogun, but sh** I'd sure like to see it happen.

Here's the full card for UFC 56, next Saturday:
Nick Thompson Vs. Keith Wisniewski (welterweight)
Sam Hoger Vs. Jeff Newton (light heavyweight)
Kevin Jordan Vs. Gabriel Gonzaga (heavyweight)
Jeremy Horn Vs. Trevor Prangley (middleweight)
Georges St. Pierre Vs. Sean Sherk (welterweight)
Matt Hughes Vs. Joe Riggs (welterweight championship)
Rich Franklin Vs. Nate Quarry (middleweight championship)

Those first three fights are a bit lack-luster, but the rest sound great. I suspect the only reason the Kevin Jordan fight's on there is so they'd have a heavyweight bout on the card, 'cuz the only thing Jordan's done so far is gas out quickly and tap to Paul Buentello in a truly suck-ass fight. Jeremy Horn dropped down a weight class, which will surely work to his advantage. The two title fights are gonna be absolutely great for obvious reasons, 'cuz they're good champions against challengers who are genuine threats (whether Nate Quarry got his shot too fast or not). St. Pierre vs Sherk could really be the show-stealer, though, I'm looking for that fight to kick some true ass. Not a bad card.

Here's my picks:
Jeremy Horn / Rd. 1 / Submission
Sean Sherk / Decision (that's right, I said it, Sherk's got St. Pierre's number)
Matt Hughes / Rd. 2 / TKO
Rich Franklin / Rd. 2 / Submission

I'm not gonna call the other three, 'cuz the only ones I've seen fight are Hoger and Jordan. But mark my words, I want them marked: There is no way in hell that Matt Hughes will lose his belt, not in this fight. Joe Riggs is a fu**in chump and will get his ass kicked. I spit in his general direction.

[onelegasy]

Well, these were my predictions and tonight i get to watch the ppv to see if I was right:

UFC 56 Predictions:

Jeremy Horn* vs. Trevor Prangley - rd1 sub

Sam Hoger* vs. Jeff Newton - rd2 TKO

Gabriel Gonzaga* vs. Kevin Jordan - rd2 sub

Georges St. Pierre vs Sean Sherk* - decision

Nick Thompson* vs. Keith Wisniewski - rd2 TKO

Thiago Alves vs Ansar Chalangov (no idea who they are)

Matt Hughes* vs. Joe Riggs (UFC title fight) - decision

Rich Franklin* vs. Nate Quarry (UFC title fight) - rd1 TKO