The MOS and the Mithril coat in the TC? (spoilers)

[Brock Landers]

Check this out from another board I go to, I found it quite interesting. If anyone is seeing ROTK tommorow, look for this and report back if it's true:



Check out the scene immediate prior to Aragorn's charge at the Black gates, he will lift his sword and you will see blood on it - shocking given that we see no battle, but good stuff for the EE. Also the mithril coat appeared for a second on the ground. Look fast.

[JEDI_THE_WHITE]

Hmm...

Actually I'll look for that on Friday. I going to the GIANT SCREEN VERSION of ROTK.

[Brock Landers]

Thank you JEDI. I gotta see this too, if it's true.

[JEDI_THE_WHITE]

It's interesting...

[Brock Landers]

And would be quite cool as well and could solve the mystery of where MOS could come in

[Cbars]

I personally can't wait to see this scene when it is complete.

[Detori]

deleted scene spotting is half the fun of seeing the theatrical cut!
for example, I'm willing to wager all my chips that the cut in point at Isengard after Saruman dies is when treebeard says "the filth of Isengard is washing away."

[Glordreen]

That actually makes sense, then when he says "For Frodo" hes refering to Frodo as he was dead that they should fight in honor of him. I gotta check for that stuff, exciting stuff.

[Brock Landers]

It never really crossed my mind to look for the spot where he should be in there. I always thought they'd change it from the books where the Captains, in the movie, ride right up to the Gate, and he comes down from one of the Towers.

[Brock Landers]

I'm quite curious to see if this is true....anyone gonna go see ROTK tommorow?

[PsYkOoOoO]

on friday..:)

[flukeman]

I might see it tonight - I'll check it out.

On another note, I have a question about another scene, when Elrond and Aragorn have their "I give hope to the Dunedain..." exchange at Dunharrow. My sister and I saw the movie for the 3rd time last week, and she swears that there were no subtitles for the first viewings. In fact she immediately turned to me and said that. For my part, I can't remember, but it seems odd that they would suddenly appear, but I do sort of remember seeing it the first time and recognizing the Elvish words from memory and not knowing exactly what was said...anyone? Or are we just nuts? :)

[adt100]

With the regard the appearance of the MOS, I always presumed that the 'cut-point' was immediately after Aragorn calls for the Lord of the Black Land to come forth, and the Gates open.

Having said that, we've already seen a very brief clip (from part of some video game footage I believe) of the MOS riding out from the Gates just as they open. He did actually seem to ride out quite far, certainly far further than the Captains of the West were standing at the point. I suppose I'll have to pay more attention when I see it again.

As for Saruman at Isengard. I had a feeling the first time I saw ROTK that this is actually 1 scene were PJ may specifically change the way the scene plays out, rather than simply add the previously cut footage.

Gandalf and co. riding to the tower of Orthanc looks as though they are on their way directly to parley with Saruman. All of a sudden Treebeard walks into shot, as though he's been hastily put in their to cater for the cut VOS. The fact that the first lines of dialgoue from Gandalf are from a wide shot (so you can't see his mouth moving) made me a little suspicious too.

[Boiiinng]

The blood on Aragorn's sword could simply be from the Pellenor, I doubt he would take the time to clean it, and the production staff would know this, leaving it worn. Does Aragorn slay the MoS in the film? I never read this, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Also, to flukeman, if the projector is not oriented properly, subtitles can fall below the screen. Better make sure your theater knows how to show movies properly. You may be missing about 10% of the film.

[adt100]

Aragorn kills the MOS in the film, yes, which seems very un-Aragorn-like to me (particularly for the film Aragorn)

If it were simply during the ensuing battle then it would be fine IMO, as the MOS could well be caught in the thick of the action along with the Orcs. To kill him in cold blood, at the end of their meeting doesn't seem quite 'right' though.

[Kashmir]

Originally posted by Glordreen
That actually makes sense, then when he says "For Frodo" hes refering to Frodo as he was dead that they should fight in honor of him. I gotta check for that stuff, exciting stuff.
I agree, this would also explain the furious charge of Merry and Pippin at that time. Cool! I can't wait to see the EE. :D

[Spy-Of-Saruman]

Originally posted by adt100
Aragorn kills the MOS in the film, yes, which seems very un-Aragorn-like to me (particularly for the film Aragorn)

If it were simply during the ensuing battle then it would be fine IMO, as the MOS could well be caught in the thick of the action along with the Orcs. To kill him in cold blood, at the end of their meeting doesn't seem quite 'right' though.

Well you have to think that he thinks they have killed Frodo and he would be enraged by it, to me when Aragorn turns around and says "For Frodo" it seems like he is VERY upset, its not the normal Aragorn face, his eyes look like his ears are filling with tears etc..

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by Boiiinng
The blood on Aragorn's sword could simply be from the Pellenor, I doubt he would take the time to clean it, and the production staff would know this, leaving it worn. Does Aragorn slay the MoS in the film? I never read this, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Have you even seen the maps at the end of the books? It's a looooooong way from Minas Tirith to the Black Gates, many days to get there. You think he actually won't clean it in that time?

[adt100]

Originally posted by Spy-Of-Saruman
Well you have to think that he thinks they have killed Frodo and he would be enraged by it, to me when Aragorn turns around and says "For Frodo" it seems like he is VERY upset, its not the normal Aragorn face, his eyes look like his ears are filling with tears etc..

The same is true in the book, only in the book Aragorn doesn't turn around and slay the messenger does he. The film-Aragorn has also seemed all along more reluctant, and slightly more passive, philosophical figure than portrayed in the book.

That's why I say it's more out of character for him.

[BaMBbLeS]

Originally posted by flukeman
On another note, I have a question about another scene, when Elrond and Aragorn have their "I give hope to the Dunedain..." exchange at Dunharrow. My sister and I saw the movie for the 3rd time last week, and she swears that there were no subtitles for the first viewings. In fact she immediately turned to me and said that. For my part, I can't remember, but it seems odd that they would suddenly appear, but I do sort of remember seeing it the first time and recognizing the Elvish words from memory and not knowing exactly what was said...anyone? Or are we just nuts? :)

Dude... the same thing happened to me. I saw ROTK three prior times before I found a screen with subtitles. I was so shocked when i saw them on my fourth veiwing. The strange thing was, everything I saw ROTK it was at the same place but in a different screen. Only one of the four screens had subtitles.

[adt100]

All 6 viewings I have had had the subtitles, and surely all prints are made from the master copy and embedded onto the film?

In which case would it not be a projectionist fault?

[BaMBbLeS]

It was only the part with Aragorn and Elrond though, that they were missing from mine. At the end, when Elrond said "The sea calls us home" or something to that effect, the subtitles were there... odd. I'm just glad I got to see it once with them.

[LegolasIsntSexy]

wait wait wait, Aragorn kills the Mouth of Sauron? did that happen in the book?

[tiff_t_t]

fluke, et al- that happened to me, too! ONE time out of 6 viewings, there were NO subtitles in that scene, but there were the subtitles @ The Grey Havens. So weird! Same theater, and everything!

[Boiiinng]

Originally posted by Brock Landers
Have you even seen the maps at the end of the books? It's a looooooong way from Minas Tirith to the Black Gates, many days to get there. You think he actually won't clean it in that time?

Well, it isn't three days in the film, it's more like 3 hours, if that. Don't confuse book time with film time.

[Brock Landers]

Yeah, I KNOW time is compressed. But ofcourse Aragorn had to clean Anduril/Narsil atleast once in that distance. Think about it.

[flukeman]

I always saw the subtitles at the Havens, and everywhere else, just not Aragorn/Elrond. The rest of the film didn't look odd though, and the other subtitles were there, so it wasn't like the projectionist scewed up...I don't know what happened. I'll look again closely next time.

[Queen Arwen]

Aragorn can't have ignored his sword for that long! Rules of chemistry and warfare dictate that a warrior must clean his sword because the blood oxidizes the iron, making it rusty and obviously not in prime condition for battle! Yeah, that's my contribution to this conversation. :)

[PsychoMike]

I didn't notice the bloody sword or the mithril armor at the black gate.

However, It would make since that there would be some time spent gathering all the survivors of Pellenor fields, and taking the injured to the house of healing. In that time Aragorn wold have had plenty of time to clean his sword.

From a production stand point there would be no reason to have blood on the sword unless he killed something. The props people wouldn't have put blood on the sword if no one had been killed. It is possible that it was left from a previous take, but I highly doubt it.

So I'm presuming that he kills MOS in the EE. That's my final thought.

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by PsychoMike
I didn't notice the bloody sword or the mithril armor at the black gate.

However, It would make since that there would be some time spent gathering all the survivors of Pellenor fields, and taking the injured to the house of healing. In that time Aragorn wold have had plenty of time to clean his sword.

From a production stand point there would be no reason to have blood on the sword unless he killed something. The props people wouldn't have put blood on the sword if no one had been killed. It is possible that it was left from a previous take, but I highly doubt it.

So I'm presuming that he kills MOS in the EE. That's my final thought.

That's my best guess. In that compressed timeframe, at some point he must have noticed BLOOD on his sword and cleaned it.

[Ghostofzion2003]

or it may be from taking over the corsair ships.

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by Ghostofzion2003
or it may be from taking over the corsair ships.

:confused: :confused: :confused:

[bigmanjg225533]

http://www.geocities.com/rotkfan2004/forfrodo4.BMP

if u look in between gandalf and aragorn u can see the mithril (sp?)shirt

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by bigmanjg225533
http://www.geocities.com/rotkfan2004/forfrodo4.BMP

if u look in between gandalf and aragorn u can see the mithril (sp?)shirt

It says the page is not available for viewing......

[bigmanjg225533]

when i click the link it works

[The_Manipulator]

Nope, doesn't work! Bummer, would like to have seen it. Didn't notice last night! :(

[bigmanjg225533]

its right when aragorn say for frodo then he turns around and start running at the orcs

[Rogue Program]

I copied and pasted the link into my address bar and it worked. After this topic was posted last night I took a look at my horrid copy of Return of the King and I also thought that when Aragorn began his charge you could see the vest on the ground. What's funny is is that there is a shot before his charge as he's turning to face Gandalf and everyone that covers the same area on the ground yet the vest is not there and then when it cuts to him charging it is there.

[The_Manipulator]

hmm....a mistake. I might vistit moviemistakes.com
they always say that LOTR got 150 mistakes at least!

[moviegeek]

it's that itty bitty shiny thing on the ground?

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by moviegeek
it's that itty bitty shiny thing on the ground?

Yep, I see it. It's there. :cool:

[The_Manipulator]

Give me the pic!! wanna see wanna see!!!!

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by The_Manipulator
Give me the pic!! wanna see wanna see!!!!

Copy and paste link in to browser.....

[Rogue Program]

That is the current theory. As far as Aragorn's blade goes, we don't see it until the gates begin to open and he quickly passes it across his face but it doesn't seem to show any signs of blood (very hard to tell though). The blood appears on the sword just before he starts his speech but the vest doesn't seem to be on the ground at this point. I would guess the optimal point to have Mouth of Sauron come out is after the orcs have surrounded our heroes, then he would give them the ultimatum, tell them about Frodo and then we get the "For Frodo" line. But if at this point Aragorn kills Mouth of Sauron then where is his body or his horse or does his body dissolve like the Witch King? Very Interesting trying to pinpoint where he shows up.

[Brock Landers]

Maybe Aragorn flashes Narsil and the MOS drops the vest in retreat on the way back to the lines. Then Aragorn kills him sometime during the battle.

[Rogue Program]

Originally posted by Brock Landers
Maybe Aragorn flashes Narsil and the MOS drops the vest in retreat on the way back to the lines. Then Aragorn kills him sometime during the battle.
Yes. That could be it.

[Boiiinng]

Originally posted by Queen Arwen
Aragorn can't have ignored his sword for that long! Rules of chemistry and warfare dictate that a warrior must clean his sword because the blood oxidizes the iron, making it rusty and obviously not in prime condition for battle! Yeah, that's my contribution to this conversation. :)

It's an elven sword, it probably cleans itself.

:rolleyes:

[Brock Landers]

Originally posted by Boiiinng
It's an elven sword, it probably cleans itself.

:rolleyes:

Oh yes, I forgot.....IT'S MAGICAL! ;)

[adt100]

Like I said earlier, we've seen the video clip of the MOS riding out from the Black Gates just as they begin to open.

With regard the blood on Aragorn's sword, bear in mind it is a very long sword, and indeed there is a little black (Orc) blood to be seen throughout the pre-battle black gate scene.

Concerning the mithril shirt, I've just got back from my 6th screening at the cinema and again I spotted nothing that really resembled the shirt at all. There are indeed lighter patches of rock and earth, and what appears to be a small white-ish patch toward the left of the gate, but that could literally be anything.

[Rogue Program]

Originally posted by adt100
Like I said earlier, we've seen the video clip of the MOS riding out from the Black Gates just as they begin to open.
Really? Do you have a link for this clip?

[adt100]

I have a look. It was posted in 1 of the clips threads in here a month or so ago.

[adt100]

Here is the thread - http://www.comingsoon.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21458

and here is the direct link to the footage - http://www.agalaxia.com.br/trailer/Retorno_do_Rei.mp4

[Glordreen]

Just got back from my 4th viewing (no school). And I checked for the Mithril vest and Aragron sword with blood before the battle starts. I saw Aragorns sword with blood on it, but I never saw the Mithril vest.

[Rogue Program]

Originally posted by adt100
Here is the thread - http://www.comingsoon.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21458

and here is the direct link to the footage - http://www.agalaxia.com.br/trailer/Retorno_do_Rei.mp4
Thank you very much for the links. I really can't wait to see this damn scene in the EE!

[Juxton]

If you guys are referring to that little silver patch on the ground in that picture....why would they just leave the vest lying there? It doesn't make any sense. Wouldn't they take it just in case they made it out of the battle alive at least to remember Frodo by? If I remember right, in the book they took it and didn't just leave it lying there.