Seraph-Judas Connection [Archive] - The ComingSoon.net Boards

Gandollum

11-10-2003, 10:40 PM

I saw Revolutions and what i dont understand is why Merovingian called Seraph Judas. I know Seraph is some sort of rebel program and that Judas represents some sort of guide or helper a lot like Seraph, but who did Seraph betray.

Boiiinng

11-10-2003, 10:52 PM

the Merovingian, I assume he used to work for him, Mero says "the prodigal child returns"

Tonkpils

11-11-2003, 12:04 AM

ha, i wish they explained this a bit more.

Gandollum

11-11-2003, 01:04 AM

Originally posted by Tonkpils
ha, i wish they explained this a bit more.

I smell a prequel

Lackey

11-11-2003, 01:10 AM

this was in another thread... posted by NE0:

"Seraph is an angel program from the very first Matrix (The perfect one). He "fell" or escaped the crash by working for Mero.

If anyone hasn't figured this out yet...Mero is the Devil. Once he fell from the good "grace's" of the system he went into exile and took other programs who didn't wish to be deleted under his protection. With the help of the Trainman Mero and his group would escape each reloading of the Matrix. Eventually, each ONE ran into Mero at some point and Mero escaped. Listen to what he tells Neo after the stairway fight in Reloaded."

Alien

11-11-2003, 04:22 PM

Originally posted by Lackey
this was in another thread... posted by NE0:

"Seraph is an angel program from the very first Matrix (The perfect one). He "fell" or escaped the crash by working for Mero.

If anyone hasn't figured this out yet...Mero is the Devil. Once he fell from the good "grace's" of the system he went into exile and took other programs who didn't wish to be deleted under his protection. With the help of the Trainman Mero and his group would escape each reloading of the Matrix. Eventually, each ONE ran into Mero at some point and Mero escaped. Listen to what he tells Neo after the stairway fight in Reloaded." Defiant prequel there. Probably another running of The animatrix.

WebMonkey

11-11-2003, 05:43 PM

Hmmmmm.

JackBauer

11-11-2003, 05:58 PM

Originally posted by Lackey

If anyone hasn't figured this out yet...Mero is the Devil.

hm, interesting, he's dressed like the devil(black/red), he acts like the devil, and club HELL...lol

well and seraph...i realy wonder what smith was talking about...to me it sounded like seraph is the 5th ONE. IMO
possible that neo returns as the angel and oracles protector...hm...im talking BS.

Boondock Saint

11-11-2003, 06:43 PM

Anybody else think that persephone was a useles character? i mean i know she brought Neo and them to the Kaymaster in Reloaded but what honest purpose did she really have? I didnt mind seeing her because Monica Bellucci is hot but still.

Baadshah

11-11-2003, 06:48 PM

it would have been cool if they brought back the Twins and Neo had to fight them at Mobil Ave.

JackBauer

11-11-2003, 06:55 PM

i agree

Rabbit

11-11-2003, 07:06 PM

Yeah, I was hoping for the Twins.

But about the devil thing, I never really pieced it together. cool.

TokenBlackMan

11-11-2003, 09:55 PM

Wasnt Judas an Angel.. or something very similiar to it.. Or was he the guardian of somebody or something.. I dont know for sure.. I am not a follower of Religion.

NE0

11-11-2003, 11:42 PM

Judas beytrayed Jesus. He was an apostle.

Mero says the Seraph betrayed him because he left Mero's side to protect The Oracle in order to find redemption. Seraph is a fallen angel. He fell with Mero and the other's who wished to go into exile rather than be "reloaded" after the "Perfect" Matrix crashed.

Rabbit

11-12-2003, 03:13 AM

Yeah. Where'd all this angel stuff come from?

dogisburning

11-12-2003, 08:22 AM

Originally posted by Baadshah
it would have been cool if they brought back the Twins and Neo had to fight them at Mobil Ave.
Neo can't use his powers at the Mobil Ave,so he'd get his ass kicked.

Rain

11-12-2003, 08:40 AM

Originally posted by Boondock Saint
Anybody else think that persephone was a useles character? i mean i know she brought Neo and them to the Kaymaster in Reloaded but what honest purpose did she really have? I didnt mind seeing her because Monica Bellucci is hot but still.

I think her purpose in the films were to show the machines interest in love most likely - she wanted to feel like she was in love, something machines wanted to discover and in my opinions did so through sati

JackBauer

11-12-2003, 09:17 AM

Originally posted by dogisburning
Neo can't use his powers at the Mobil Ave,so he'd get his ass kicked.

thats true, they would kill him

Diabolik

11-12-2003, 11:27 AM

anyone noticed that the mobil ave. at the trainstation is an anagram of limbo.
the place between life and death.
cool thing to have the mero being the devil.

redpill

11-12-2003, 11:35 AM

yep weve been talkin about limbo since the 1st trailers came out months a go

Alien

11-12-2003, 03:46 PM

Originally posted by Diabolik
anyone noticed that the mobil ave. at the trainstation is an anagram of limbo.
the place between life and death.
cool thing to have the mero being the devil. Ok, yeah, someone else pointed that out but why call it Mobil Ave and not just Limbo Ave?

ScRipt

11-12-2003, 03:49 PM

there tricky those brothers

Spyder2294

11-12-2003, 08:48 PM

The way I saw it was that when Mero called Seraph "a little Judas" he was referring to Seraph betraying Morph and Trinity to him (he's placed a bounty on them after all). Obviously Seraph was not there to turn them in, but it felt like Mero was trying to sew seeds of mistrust among them.

thecastrated

11-12-2003, 09:45 PM

Spy, thats the best I hav seen..

JackBauer

11-12-2003, 09:54 PM

sounds cool

Boiiinng

11-13-2003, 01:17 AM

Originally posted by Spyder2294
The way I saw it was that when Mero called Seraph "a little Judas" he was referring to Seraph betraying Morph and Trinity to him (he's placed a bounty on them after all). Obviously Seraph was not there to turn them in, but it felt like Mero was trying to sew seeds of mistrust among them.

Mero says "my little Judas" making Seraph the betrayer to the Merovingian

rilocay

11-13-2003, 04:16 AM

If Seraph is Judas and he betrayed Merovingian, that makes Mero Jesus because the One is portrayed as Jesus... And from this we can conclude that Mero is one of the previous Ones (most likely the first & original 'One' because he survived Neo's predececors). And this may confirm the merv/one theory that was talked about after Reloaded. Also Persephone says that he was once like Neo back in the urinal kiss scene. Also Merv's program job is only to know everything (in a way similar to the oracle) but he clearly demonstrated his knowledge of programs and making (or editing them) with the Orgasm cake.

Anyone like that?

Spyder2294

11-13-2003, 01:58 PM

Right, "my little Judas" meaning "my little traitor" meaning one who betrays at my bidding. "Are you here for the bounty, Seraph?"

You guys are going a little overboard on Merv being a previous one etc.

Boiiinng

11-13-2003, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by Spyder2294
Right, "my little Judas" meaning "my little traitor" meaning one who betrays at my bidding. "Are you here for the bounty, Seraph?"

You guys are going a little overboard on Merv being a previous one etc.

and you are going overboard on the Judas line, Seraph betrayed Mero by siding with the Oracle, Mero got mad and wanted to punish the Oracle by stealing her shell, it's all said in that scene...it was Trinity's choice to go to the Merovingian himself, not Seraph's, so he is not the betrayer to Morph and Trin, it doesn't work

Knerys

11-13-2003, 05:48 PM

I think he was referring to Seraph betraying himslef, the Merovingian and the bounty line was a joke on those line. "You betrayed me, so are you betraying them as well?"

As the Merv as jesus yeah, I think you guys are reading too much into it. Judas is applied to any one who has betrayed you.

Knerys

11-13-2003, 05:50 PM

Knerys

11-13-2003, 05:53 PM

Originally posted by Boondock Saint
Anybody else think that persephone was a useles character? i mean i know she brought Neo and them to the Kaymaster in Reloaded but what honest purpose did she really have? I didnt mind seeing her because Monica Bellucci is hot but still. She all part of that cause and effect. She a variable int he equation if you will. Merv pissed her off, she retaliated.

Spyder2294

11-13-2003, 05:53 PM

so he is not the betrayer to Morph and Trin, it doesn't work

Right, as I said before:

Obviously Seraph was not there to turn them in, but it felt like Mero was trying to sew seeds of mistrust among them.

It also made the scene more suspenseful as the audience wondered if Seraph had tricked them and wanted to collect the bounty on their heads.

MMRempen

11-14-2003, 06:35 PM

This is actually a really cool reading into the Matrix. I love this trilogy for this reason; it's the little things the brothers stick in there. It feels like nothing is wasted, everything is there for a reason.

Bravo, Wachowskis.